DSM and races.. is it time?

[Andy Greene]

I dont think the "impound" is the issue , if I see this discussion properly- its about making sure your traveling partner is your pit man - you said so yourself. Again , not my place / thats on you guys.

"I consider it a courtesy for a club to allow race partners who travel to their events."

" Lets make it hard for people to pair up and travel. And people ask why I don't go to certain sites."

Mic

 

[HTV Boats]

Andy I believe the first post here was about getting rid of non DSM and the partner racing was a sidebar. Ergo my last post.
We obviously differ on the aspect of racing advantage vs accommodating racers. Guys who partner up generally like the same boats and support numbers to make classes larger. Your argument kind of makes it seem like toy boat racers are cheating. No money involved and surely only 15 min of glory and we are purposely tipping the scales. I have pulled myself off the course before a any CD had to DQ me if I felt I made an infraction. I welcome running against the fastest boat. I like shootout formats that group the top scorers and I believe any of the "racing partners" I know will have no problem running each other if they make the cut. Knowing you have a stable pit and drivers stand situation makes it easier to decide where you race. The club or organization running the race has the right to play hardball with their rules. I have the right to choose not to attend if I look forward to chasing around the pits finding people to pit all day long. Not fun after you spend a lot of time and money to travel.
Mic

 

[JimZaremski]

With so few crystal radios actually being used I see no reason for the host club to impound or offer frequency clips. Let those using non DSM police themselves and things will soon evolve on their own.
Mic

yep. it helps, though, to insist on people disclosing their radio type and crystal (if needed) when they pre-register. that way at least you're prepared ahead of time as a CD. I think at my last race in August, we had two analog radios registered, one in 27 MHz and one in 75.

 

[Rudy Formanek]

Either you allow people to not race certain people or you don't. Mostly only applies to the few large races like the Nats. Don't want to race your pitman, don't race the same class. You both race the same class, you may race each other! Crickey there's two dozen classes!!

 

[DPeterson]

If I understand correctly the two race registration sites do shuffle the entries. At least to the point that there is a mix. Pretty sure the one race we attended our entries were manually manipulated to put a certain few of us in the same heats. It was more than a coincident. This race did not use shootout scoring. Other races have been just fine. We expect to be in some heats together when we travel - just not all of them. The shootout system fixes most of the issue.

Seems there is a glitch with registration. Most run DSM and get shuffled (or manipulated). Some register MHZ but run DSM (is that right or fair). Some register MHZ and run MHZ. Obviously something for the association(s) leaders to chew on.

Doug

 

[Tom Foley]

NO , it's not time . Plenty of good 75 Mghz equipment out there working just fine . Anyone falsely entering on 75 and then switching up at the races does so in violation of the rules . I don't care one way or the other as I always have to find a pitperson for every class so I'm used to it . Most radio problems are switch or battery related it seems and have nothing to do with interference .

 

[Grimracer]

good conversation...

I would however like some clarification on this Tom.

"Anyone falsely entering on 75 and then switching up at the races does so in violation of the rules"

How does one falsely enter on 75?

Thanks in advance.

Grim

 

[Grimracer]

And then.. the reason I bring this up..

Every year.. for the last 10 years or so somebody.. they come from all over.. asks me about this very topic. I know others hear it too..

I am not suggesting we change radios or force ANYBODY to buy new stuff.. thats not what this is about.

The REAL issue is people signing up on 75mhz so they dont have to race certain people.


I also dont subscribe to the "I need a certain pit person" or I am going to do bad.. true you can get a bad launch.. we have all got them and we have all given them. It happens. If you know somebody who is bad at it.. dont ask them to help you.

I as the driver take FULL responsibility for my race. Caller.. tell me where the dead boats are at EACH LAP and count my laps.. THATS ALL.. dont tell me when to turn.. dont tell me where to place the boat on the course. I do all I can to remove my caller from my 6 laps. It would be foolish to remove them completely. (we all get this).

With that.. i can have ANYBODY call for me that has at least 6 fingers.. its just that simple. Do I prefer my racing bud Big B.. sure.. (thats what buds are for!)


I dont see us (The RC boating community) changing to 2.4 only anytime soon. Truth is I dont care if you use two empty tin cans and a string to your boat. But to sign up JUST to "be a team" (my words) or not have to run a certain person.. thats is character iffy.. (and as long as we have all been doing this.. we have seen some of that too!)


I also feel its good to talk about this stuff.. have a conversation to better understand where we are all at on this subject.. it comes up at EVERY race I go to..

Thanks

Grim

 

[Tom Foley]

Some will enter on a 75 MGHZ frequency that they don't even support and then just run DSM at the race . I think you know what I meant . Like I said it doesn't ruffle my feathers at all and I don't care who I race in any given heat . I hope to run with the best to keep me as close to the top as I can get .

 

[Grimracer]

Thanks Tom.. I did not understand the "Violation" part and did not word my question well.. Violation typically introduces a penalty. I dont know what that would be and was confused. (Still am I guess LOL)

No issue.. I did get your idea.. Thanks

Grim

 

[Tom Foley]

I guess what I was thinking was that on a valid entry certain info has to be noted . If a guy puts down a "Fantasy Frequency " then does not use it or change it then there is a cloud of fraud .Lol .

 

[timothy johnson]

Over time I think most racer's will gravitate to the DSM radio's anyway. I have raced at several of the top nitro events for the last 10 years and if a racer finishes well in his or her heats everyone will end up running against each other for the top position. Two years ago at the IMPBA national's after the first round the remaining heats were run based on your previous score. Top score people ran against each other and the lower score people ran against each other. In this format people with lower scores for what ever reason still had a chance to improve there standings. At every event I have attended I have had a friend of my choice pit for me but at some point we have run against each other unless one of us doesn't race in that class. All is good leave it alone because time will fix it if you think it's a problem. I have many friends that still use the older radio's and I would hate for them not to race for any reason.

 

[Joe Warren]

Well after Joh knight went ape sxit on this topic. I started entering every race DSM & contuined to run crystal radios I did not own a DSM system... I done it for 2/3 years. it did Not create any problems & it did Not Fix any Problems. So The Knight Myth theory was Bull Sxit.... Today I have Both systems & enter accordingly...... Flame away.....

 

[Joe Warren]

Over time I think most racer's will gravitate to the DSM radio's anyway. I have raced at several of the top nitro events for the last 10 years and if a racer finishes well in his or her heats everyone will end up running against each other for the top position. Two years ago at the IMPBA national's after the first round the remaining heats were run based on your previous score. Top score people ran against each other and the lower score people ran against each other. In this format people with lower scores for what ever reason still had a chance to improve there standings. At every event I have attended I have had a friend of my choice pit for me but at some point we have run against each other unless one of us doesn't race in that class. All is good leave it alone because time will fix it if you think it's a problem. I have many friends that still use the older radio's and I would hate for them not to race for any reason.

Good Point & this is Correct. Most Big Events are running a Point system that Have the Top 6 boats race against each other the Last heat or the Last 2 heats. So at that point changes Must be made.. Good Point Tim....

 

[Joe Warren]

I guess what I was thinking was that on a valid entry certain info has to be noted . If a guy puts down a "Fantasy Frequency " then does not use it or change it then there is a cloud of fraud .Lol .

............ that happens at you race every year.

 

[Joe Warren]

I have many feelings on this one , but will refrain from a long winded post the best I can - because simply, I dont race any more and its not my place to have a say. That said, Over the 10 years I was racing , I have seen this one first hand many times and to a degree I almost see some of the reasoning that goes into entering on the same frequencies , but have never been a fan of it. They are excuses at best , especially for the ones that have been around for many years and seem to be "in the hunt" at the end of a weekend all the time. It creates an advantage for a group of pretty fast guys right off the bat if you ask me, I get the " they dont know my equip - Im used to my spotter - We work better together " argument , but at the end of the day , they are excuses. If in all these years of doing this , you dont know enough people that know you and your boats - something is wrong, and sharing equipment is a creation of your own doing by running all the same classes, you forced yourself to do that - by choice. Its part of a level playing field is what Im trying to say. thats all, too many people overcome these issues with planning and do just fine................

Thats not the only reason people are staying away BTW.....

Big races are running point systems that require those same guy to get busted up & DO have to race each other before the weekend is over.

 

[Joe Warren]

ask the other racers that are Participating in the same classes. I dont think there is a advantage if Friends help each other in the same classes... I do not see it as a advantage. I certianly dont have a problem w it.....

 

[Grimracer]

Thanks for the input everybody...

What if.. (Hypothetical) on the sign up sites we just did away with registering frequencies? Most on here say.. with the current state of things.. we just dont see problems anymore anyway.


Grim

 

[Hydro Junkie]

What if.. (Hypothetical) on the sign up sites we just did away with registering frequencies? Most on here say.. with the current state of things.. we just dont see problems anymore anyway.
Grim

That might be the best option now days. With probably 75% of boaters using 2.4, I doubt you will see many that will have frequency conflicts any more. If they do, it's up to them to figure out how to deal with the conflict

 

[DPeterson]

Thanks for the input everybody...

What if.. (Hypothetical) on the sign up sites we just did away with registering frequencies? Most on here say.. with the current state of things.. we just dont see problems anymore anyway.

That would certainly take care of part of the issue. Now its down to the integrity and character of the persons actually setting up the heat sheets.