Jersey Skiff vs Cracker box...fair?

[Skoda450]

In IMPBA, clubs are running Jersey Skiffs and Cracker Box hulls in the same heat. I am a CB fan and very much enjoy the class BUT I think this is a bad practice. I know the clubs are trying to generate a compete field for racing when there are not enough CBs to make a class, but throwing a faster, better corrnering hull aqgainst them is the wrong answer. Part of my problem is that Jersey Skiff is not an IMPBA defined class. There are lots of restrictions on the CBs from IMPBA and NAMBA. NAMBA even splits CB into two classes. Yes , I know they recognise Jersey Skiff but IMPBA does not.

Any one have a comment? I am a little frustrated that the CB class that was fun to run and provided an entry level to true racing is going down hill fast.

 

[Rokieboater]

In IMPBA, clubs are running Jersey Skiffs and Cracker Box hulls in the same heat. I am a CB fan and very much enjoy the class BUT I think this is a bad practice. I know the clubs are trying to generate a compete field for racing when there are not enough CBs to make a class, but throwing a faster, better corrnering hull aqgainst them is the wrong answer. Part of my problem is that Jersey Skiff is not an IMPBA defined class. There are lots of restrictions on the CBs from IMPBA and NAMBA. NAMBA even splits CB into two classes. Yes , I know they recognise Jersey Skiff but IMPBA does not.
Any one have a comment? I am a little frustrated that the CB class that was fun to run and provided an entry level to true racing is going down hill fast.

So what is your solution/answer to the problem?

Is the option not to race either class when not enough boats are present??? Or deny one class from racing when not enough of its class is not present???

I would rather race my boat against any boat, than not race at all.

Just my .02 cents.

Robert

 

[Skoda450]

My problem is that Jersey Skiffs are allowed in a IMPBA sanction race at all. Adding them to the CB class weakens the CB participation. My solution would be to take CB back to what it was in the begining; an unpiped stock motor with canister muffler where sucess depended more on driving skill than $ invested. If individuals want to start a Skiff class, it shouldn't be at the expense of an already troubled CB class. :huh:

 

[Skoda450]

?

 

[piper_chuck]

My problem is that Jersey Skiffs are allowed in a IMPBA sanction race at all. Adding them to the CB class weakens the CB participation. My solution would be to take CB back to what it was in the begining; an unpiped stock motor with canister muffler where sucess depended more on driving skill than $ invested. If individuals want to start a Skiff class, it shouldn't be at the expense of an already troubled CB class. :huh:

Two comments.

First, I agree with what you say about changing CB back to what it was. Unfortunately, the changes were voted in by the membership and reversing such a decision is difficult. The way to do it is write a proposal, submit it, and then sell your idea. Rather than changing the class, I wonder if you might have better luck creating a new Stock CB class? Try it at your club and see what the interest is.

Moving on to Skiffs, there is nothing in the IMPBA rules to prevent clubs or even districts from supporting local interest by offering non-IMPBA classes that members want. The D12 Stock Gas class is an example. There's also nothing in the rules to prevent them from combining classes due to limited numbers of participants. When offering a race where the number of boats is small we have the choice of not running it if the number of boats is below the minimum or possibly combining it so the the people get to run. Which is better, combining a class so a boat owner at least gets a chance to run, or not offering it at all?

Is this low participation in CBs due to a lack of interest in running them any more or because Skiffs were allowed to run and have dominated the competition? As I mentioned in another thread, at our race for the last two years, there were only 3 boats each year. Last year I think it was 2 CBs and one Skiff. The CBs took first and second. This year we had NO CBs, but 3 skiffs were entered and ran. If a couple people had entered CBs, they would have been combined with the skiffs because when you're trying to run a big race it's just not fair to other people to run a class with only 2 boats. Larger participation by CBs could have given them their own class, but since there were none this year, that's a moot point.

 

[John Crouch]

I am sorry that the cracker box class has gone the way that it has. One of my first boat builds was a Dumas cracker box kit that I ran for 3 years. Started out with cannister muffler and then went over to the tuned pipe when the rules were changed. I really would like to either see it go back to cannister mufflers or offer a class with stock engine. That is what got me excited about the classic thunderboat class, motorwise everyone should be equal. Some boats are a little faster due to design, but it relies a LOT on the driver skills.

I do not think that the Skiffs are "faster" than modded crackers, Mine will run just over 54mph (on gps) The main thing is the way that skiffs turn on there sides when turning, they don't slide as much as crackers in the turns.

At that 2nd District race there were 3 skiffs and my cracker that ran. I came in 2nd place over all. There were not enough boats entered in the 3rd race so I did not get to run it. I have had some issues with the boat not wanting to turn at times and have finally figured out the problem and will see how it does at the next district race in 2 weeks.

John Crouch

 

[Skoda450]

All,

Thanks for the thoughts. I just wanted to hear from others who have a dog in that fight and might have an opinon on the subject. There was no way of opening the subject without sounding like I was whining. So if I did, so be it. I will have my home built cracker at the ODMBC district race and will race. I had it at Delmarva but I could not get it started and had to scratch it for the week end. See you all there!!

 

[John Crouch]

Well there will be at least 2 crackers at the odmba race cause I am bringing mine as well. Larry Hubert used to run one, I dont know if he still does or not. The last time I was at a race there was 2004. needless to say I took a few years off but have been pretty hard at it this year. Only race that I have missed in D12 this year was the NC race, I just couldnt swing the money for gas for that one.

See ya there, John Crouch

 

[Henrietta]

Well there will be at least 2 crackers at the odmba race cause I am bringing mine as well. Larry Hubert used to run one, I dont know if he still does or not. The last time I was at a race there was 2004. needless to say I took a few years off but have been pretty hard at it this year. Only race that I have missed in D12 this year was the NC race, I just couldnt swing the money for gas for that one.
See ya there, John Crouch

Yes Dad (Larry Hibbert) still runs one but has had a rough year and will not be participating as a racer this time - broke his collar bone a few weeks ago in a bicycle wreck. Even though I'm his pit person the chances of re-injury are too risky. Tommy (the boy) will be there with his as well and is raring to go.

 

[John Crouch]

I am very sorry to hear that about Larry. the last year that I ran there club races was 2004, very hard to believe that it has been 4 years!! I enjoyed running boats there with all of you and if it wasnt for the distance I would come over for the club races but I just cannot afford to with gas prices what they are.... I am looking to seeing Mike T, Larry H, John F and of course Preston and all the others this weekend...

John C

 

[Ron Olson]

I can see where there is a problem as the C-box class does have very specific rules which are also different from the IMPBA and NAMBA. You might want to ask then why did they allow NAMBA C-boxes run at the IMPBA Gas Nat's but you more than likely not be able to do the opposite.

Since there isn't a Jersey Skiff class yet in the IMPBA then they shouldn't be allowed to run period! They are illegal in the C-box class by the rules. Just because somebody manufactures a hull doesn't make it legal or neccessary to make a class for it.

Why not throw them into the mono class if there aren't enough? Most C-boxes and JS's can run with them anyway speed and handling wise nowadays when properly set up.

How long is it going to be before the Thunderboat class goes to Hell in a handbasket?

 

[piper_chuck]

Since there isn't a Jersey Skiff class yet in the IMPBA then they shouldn't be allowed to run period! They are illegal in the C-box class by the rules. Just because somebody manufactures a hull doesn't make it legal or neccessary to make a class for it.Why not throw them into the mono class if there aren't enough? Most C-boxes and JS's can run with them anyway speed and handling wise nowadays when properly set up.

There is nothing in the IMPBA rule book to prevent a club or a district from creating their own class or combining classes of their choice. When faced with people wanting to run skiffs and crackers, but not enough of either to make the minimum boat count for a class, the choice is combine them, put them with something else, or don't let anyone run them. I've yet to see a skiff or cracker that handled well enough to hang with the monos. Also, many of the people with a skiff or cracker also have a mono. For the races in question, skiffs and crackers combined have had enough numbers to run together, but not apart.

 

[John Crouch]

At our last d12 race we had 3 crackers and 3-4 skiffs. overall for the weekend Earl Eber ended up 1st place overall with his skiff and I ended up 2nd overall with my cracker. I was having trouble in the turns, but have now figured how to get it to turn a lot better. getting a 22.5 pound boat to turn @ 54mph can be tricky!!! I believe now that I have figured out the steering issues, I just might be able to take a first overall at the next race... I look at it this way, I still get to run mine and they get to run theres, so all is good.

John

 

[Steve Seebold]

What difference does it make? What is a guy to do if he shows up with his JSS and there are no others. In NAMBA it takes 3 boats to make a class. Let the guy race, but give him points in the JSS class, not in CB. JMO