IMPBA & AMA Discussion

[Greg Hahn]

Also on the upside through several AMA surveys we found that over 26% of present AMA membership owns at least one model boat. that's 40,000 boat owners so the possibility to grow the IMPBA membership is huge.food for thought

gh

Has there been a survey of IMPBA members to see how many are also AMA members?

Chuck, not that I know of, none of the PTB have mentioned anything about it.

If I had to take a stab at it, I'd guess 20 to 25 %.

Every evening at the internats we had several flyers out in the grass field till dark. Planes and Heli's

it's a good workable mix, a definate win win for both organizations

gh

 

[steve wood]

this could be only a win win for both sides, especially impba. looks like the ama has 40x more boaters than the impba

 

[Ron Zaker Jr]

Just curious,
How many people know about the impba's talks with the ama, and has anyone heard of any news regard this.

thanks

chris

Sounds like not many PAYING MEMBERS know much at all about this, strange.

Ron Jr

 

[Kevin Sheren]

I've been in contact with Greg Hahn today. We will be meeting in mid November to discuss the options and questions that IMPBA has with the AMA. Both Gerg and I want to do what is best for BOTH Organizations. Then it will go to the board and be put in the Roostertail for the membership.

IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS YOU WOULD LIKE TO ASK ME OR HAVE ME ASK GREG IN OUR MEETING PLEASE EMAIL THEM TO ME AT [email protected]

Please put in the subject line AMA/IMPBA

Kevin Sheren

 

[Ron Zaker Jr]

I've been in contact with Greg Hahn today. We will be meeting in mid November to discuss the options and questions that IMPBA has with the AMA. Both Gerg and I want to do what is best for BOTH Organizations. Then it will go to the board and be put in the Roostertail for the membership.
IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS YOU WOULD LIKE TO ASK ME OR HAVE ME ASK GREG IN OUR MEETING PLEASE EMAIL THEM TO ME AT [email protected]

Please put in the subject line AMA/IMPBA

Kevin Sheren

Kevin,

Is this meeting a one on one, or a round table type format? Directors? Members? Insurance agents?

 

[Kevin Sheren]

At this time it will be Greg and myself one on one.

Ron check your pm.

Kevin

 

[Chris Wood]

Well here is my take,

if the insurance is equal or better we are already ahead because we DON"T HAVE TO HAGGLE OVER IT YEAR AFTER YEAR. JUST LIKE GRIM SAID.

PLUS, and this hasn't been brought up much.

year after year, after year, after year, after year, after year, after year, after year.. we have a hard time finding a place or club to host the nats..The AMA has stepped up with a GREAT lake and the option to have a NATIONAL EVENT every year, key part EVERY YEAR at the same spot.. man wouldn't that be nice to know every year that we know where the internats is going to be and NOT have to worry about it at all. Not only that but CENTRALLY LOCATED IN THE USA!!

No more, wait till someone steps up to hoist it or WHERE IS IT GOING TO BE SO I CAN PLAN OR TRY TO GET VACATION, oh darn it is going to be this month instead of that month, can't make it because bob took that week off so i have to work for him.. at least you would know, when where and so on.

but hey, i am just been a boat racer for a long time what do i know.

chris

 

[dr gary turner]

I would like to see a detailed list of the reasons for becoming a subgroup of AMA. Also the disadvantages, ie will it cost the members more, do we loose control of the management of our dues, do we pay our dues then to AMA and they transfer the remainder of the dues after extracting the cost of the insurance to IMPBA account? Do we pay IMPBA our dues then IMPBA cuts a check to AMA for the insurance? Does the AMA have rules and reg's that have to be met to be an AMA member that differ from IMPBA? Do we loose any autonomy in governace of IMPBA by being a sub group of AMA? Does the President and or any board members have any position on the board of the AMA and what role do they have in the governance of AMA? Do decisions of the AMA board supercede our board and Presidential decision? Are IMPBA members as a subgroup of AMA able to run for office in AMA, nominate individuals for office and vote in the AMA general election? Also can AMA members do likewise in IMPBA?

In general I think the insurance issue is important but also careful consideration needs to be given to many associated issues.

 

[Joe Warren]

I would like to see a detailed list of the reasons for becoming a subgroup of AMA. Also the disadvantages, ie will it cost the members more, do we loose control of the management of our dues, do we pay our dues then to AMA and they transfer the remainder of the dues after extracting the cost of the insurance to IMPBA account? Do we pay IMPBA our dues then IMPBA cuts a check to AMA for the insurance? Does the AMA have rules and reg's that have to be met to be an AMA member that differ from IMPBA? Do we loose any autonomy in governace of IMPBA by being a sub group of AMA? Does the President and or any board members have any position on the board of the AMA and what role do they have in the governance of AMA? Do decisions of the AMA board supercede our board and Presidential decision? Are IMPBA members as a subgroup of AMA able to run for office in AMA, nominate individuals for office and vote in the AMA general election? Also can AMA members do likewise in IMPBA?
In general I think the insurance issue is important but also careful consideration needs to be given to many associated issues.

Well maybe Someone will answer all of the questions???? I guess we can sanaction NAMBA. Some clubs in Dist #5 are already dual sanactioned IMPBA / NAMBA..

 

[Grimracer]

Doc.. your very right.. we do need to get all the details.. very important.. good point... im sure all that will be on the table when the time comes.

IMBPA, AMA.. Mr, Hahn.. you have my support.

Grim

 

[bzubee]

Chris there still has to be a club /group to bring their support equipment and run the race.

Well here is my take,
if the insurance is equal or better we are already ahead because we DON"T HAVE TO HAGGLE OVER IT YEAR AFTER YEAR. JUST LIKE GRIM SAID.

PLUS, and this hasn't been brought up much.

year after year, after year, after year, after year, after year, after year, after year.. we have a hard time finding a place or club to host the nats..The AMA has stepped up with a GREAT lake and the option to have a NATIONAL EVENT every year, key part EVERY YEAR at the same spot.. man wouldn't that be nice to know every year that we know where the internats is going to be and NOT have to worry about it at all. Not only that but CENTRALLY LOCATED IN THE USA!!

No more, wait till someone steps up to hoist it or WHERE IS IT GOING TO BE SO I CAN PLAN OR TRY TO GET VACATION, oh darn it is going to be this month instead of that month, can't make it because bob took that week off so i have to work for him.. at least you would know, when where and so on.

but hey, i am just been a boat racer for a long time what do i know.

chris

 

[Sean Bowf]

Where is this centrally located lake??

Sean

 

[gooycheese]

As far as location is concerned I am pretty sure it is Muncie IN. I have done some asking around in D4 and as far as I can tell linking up with the AMA is a positive for sure. There are some issues that need to be worked out from what I have understood, but I am pretty sure as soon as there is some word weather good or bad we all will know. Thank You to all that are putting the time and effort into making this union

Paul

 

[Sean Bowf]

As far as location is concerned I am pretty sure it is Muncie IN.

I figured it was something like that Paul. Seems a lot of folks on the east side of the country, forget there is a west side. Mainly just curious, doubt I would ever go unless it was actually centrally located (as opposed to center of the east side of the country).

I kind of like the idea of it moving around year to year...but after almost losing it this year, I can understand why folks would want a plan that runs from year to year.

Thanks,

Sean

 

[piper_chuck]

Where is this centrally located lake??
Sean

Plug this address into your favorite mapping tool to locate the AMA International Aeromodeling Center: 5161 E Memorial Dr

Muncie IN 47302. Here's a PDF map of the site: http://www.modelaircraft.org/PDF-files/Map2007.pdf

I do not know exactly where the 3000 by 500 foot lake is, I can't see it on google earth.

 

[Bill-SOCAL]

Typically the way a SIG works like this:

1) All SIG members are REQUIRED to be AMA Members. You pay your annual dues to the AMA directly. Currently Open adult annual dues is $58. Your AMA dues includes the insurance coverage, a Monthly magazine, and supports all the other programs of the AMA. ALL SIG members, being AMA members, have all the same rights and privileges as any other AMA member. This includes voting on the District VP, the President, and Exec VP.

2) SIGs may, or may not, have their own dues which they collect and do with them what they wish. LSF has no dues. IMAC, IMAA, NSRCA, all have their own dues. The dues are separate things. AMA takes no money from the dues of the SIG and the SIG does not get part of the AMA dues.

3) SIGs that have a competition orientation are subject to the rules procedure as determined by the AMA. This includes a 2 year rules cycle, a set procedure for proposing rules, a set review and approval process (not voted on by all members, rules are voted on by a contest Board). Many SIGS do have their own procedural rules that are not part of the AMA process. LSF has a system of achievement awards levels (Level I, Level II, etc.). These are separate from the AMA Competition rules.

4) The SIG can have (and usually does) have its own Board of Directors, officers, etc. The SIG leadership has no direct relation to the AMA leadership. They do not attend EC meetings, etc.

In reality the AMA has a pretty much hands off policy with their SIGS. The major contact comes in the rules process (if applicable) and in the running of the NATS. Most of the NATS events are run by the particular SIG. IMAC runs the scale aerobatics NATS, LSF runs the Soaring NATS, and so on. One thing to keep in mind, if it works the way all the other SIGS work, ANY adult AMA member in good standing can submit a rules proposal in any area. So even though you might be a control line guy there is nothing stopping you from submitting a rule proposal for soaring for instance. This is usually not an issue, but it is the way it works.

Hope that helps.

 

[piper_chuck]

As far as location is concerned I am pretty sure it is Muncie IN.

I figured it was something like that Paul. Seems a lot of folks on side of the country, forget there is a west side. Mainly just curious, doubt I would ever go unless it was actually centrally located (as opposed to center of the east side of the country).

I kind of like the idea of it moving around year to year...but after almost losing it this year, I can understand why folks would want a plan that runs from year to year.

Thanks,

Sean

Similar things could be said of North vs South locations. Central is a relative term.

And, while it's nice to think of an official IMPBA lake, it's not entirely clear that holding the Internats at one place every year would be a good or a bad thing. Yet another topic for discussion at some point in the future...

 

[Chris Wood]

indiana, aka muncie i where i speak of.. pretty close to central part of USA.

listen all, my hole point of this thread was not to start a big Pi$$ing match. i wanted to mearly find out.. HOW MANY IMPBA MEMBERS accually even knew of this topic. and what there thoughts are on this..

so far.. i think a very VERY limited amount of people know about his, and that is not a good thing.

Bill,

I understand that a club would put it on. Maybe in the future that would not need to take place.. But wouldn't it make it easier for a club to WANT to host the national event when all the lake prep and what have you could possibly be taken care of??

chris

 

[El Zorro]

Evidently not many IMPBA members remember that back when I was IMPBA President ( 1995-1998 ) Jim Irwin and I were trying to get AMA to consent to putting a lake on their property big enough to race model boats in. They had just moved to Muncie, Indiana from Reston, Virginia. They also had had some money to spend and even after the move were soliciting its membership to " help pay off the property in Muncie ". I still have a few different copies of AMA's " Master Plans " of what would be built on the property. BOTH of these include a lake for model boat racing. Jim Irwin had a friend in Muncie who was in the excavating and gravel business that agreed to dig a big enough lake on AMA's property FOR FREE...........ALL HE WANTED WAS WHAT HE DUG UP. This was to be connected to the existing pond next to their headquarters building, which I believe is spring fed. Jim and I would talk with one person in charge one week and be led to believe we had the okay to start the ball rolling and when the excavating guy went over to the property to take soil samples, etc. they would chase him away with different reasons. This happened on three separate occasions before Jim and I gave this up as a lost cause and a big waste of time. Jim and I even sat down with then AMA President Dave Brown and Executive Director Joyce Hager at the Toledo Show one year and thought we had things on the way to being ironed out but then the dirt guy got chased away for the third time and he finally said screw 'em. Jim lived right there in Muncie and talked with the AMA people on a regular basis. If you get the chance ask Jim how much they jerked HIM around. Back then IMPBA had about 2500 members and they didn't care about us. What makes you think they care about 1200 or 1300 members now?

Someone needs to do what Priscilla and I did back in 1997 and do some serious shopping around for some good, affordable insurance. We saved IMPBA and its members more than $18,000 that next year in premiums. The dues need to be higher ( sorry, just a fact of life ) to keep up with the times and run IMPBA like the business it is and needs to be for it's members.

Forget AMA. You want to be part of AMA, go buy an airplane. Keep playing in this sandbox thats been around for almost sixty years.............it ain't broke, it just needs a little fixing.

Dick Tyndall

IMPBA 9407

AMA 12532 ( 1963-2001 )

 

[Bill-SOCAL]

I'm curious about something. It seems that the major motivation here is due to insurance issues for IMPBA. Why can NAMBA get insurance, and to me what seems like a better all around policy, and IMPBA seems to have a huge issue?? Can't IMPBA get the same policy that NAMBA has?? And if not, why not? It seems to me that going to the AMA is a very complex way to solve what should be a fairly straight forward issue.