How about a 180 (30cc) glow motor?

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Mark,

Thanks, but I will have to get back to you in a while when I am less busy. I already have all the timing, port radius, angle and chord width info measured up somewhere.... ;D

Ian.
 
Ian,

Cool, all the hard stuff is taken care of then. I hate measuring up ports.
 
Mark,

Ok, I found the info.

A100.

Bore: 29mm

Stroke: 26mm

5 port: 1 exhaust, 2 transfer, 2 boost.

Transfers: 127 degrees duration, 14mm chord width, 1.5mm radius at top corners, angled up 32 degrees, angled across 40 degrees.

Boost: 123 degree duration, 9.5mm chord width, 1.5mm radius at top corners, angled up 54 degrees.

Exhaust: 181 degrees duration. Measured chord widths at 11 evenly spaced stations starting from the top of the port:

21.1

25.3

26.08

25.75

23.93

21.95

21.73

21.65

20.95

19.32

13.73

Runs at 19000 rpm (from tacho), would like to run at 22000 rpm

A-90HP

Bore: 28mm

Stroke: 24mm

5 ports, 1 exhaust, 2 transfers, 2 boost.

Transfers: 128 degrees duration, 11.1mm chord width, 1.5mm radius in top corners, angled up 25 degrees, angled across 28 degrees.

Boost: 128 degrees duration, 9.7mm chord width, 1.5mm radius in top corners, angled up 48 degrees.

Exhaust:183 degrees duration. Measured chord widths at 11 evenly spaced stations starting from the top of the port:

10.8

23.59

24.92

25.21

24.70

22.95

21.40

20.97

20.14

18.51

13.25

Runs at 22000 to 23000 rpm. (from tacho)

Have fun! 8)

Ian.
 
Just looking at those numbers I would be dropping the A100 liner a litte... What am I saing... I WILL drop my liner a little!!!! Will raise the exhaust accordingly...

Took my A100 out on the weekend... was going ok... pushing a pitched up H50 but not really revving... lots more revs with the Andy Brown 1475 and 1470 (both pitched up)...

EMS Racing
 
Ian,

This might finally solve the time / area debate we've been talking about offline ;D

How did the testing go on the weekend?

Tim.
 
Craig,

I have lowered liners in the A motors before, and have rasied some too....

Actually I have realised that I lowered the liner in the A-90 listed above, I will edit the timings appropriately.... 8)

I ran my current A-90HP (not the one listed above, but I have no tacho readings on my current motor) in the Hummingbird, my best speeds were with a stock H-50, it was doing 124k in the corners! Damn thing scares me, it will take a while to get used to driving a boat that quick... I dont know how you guys do it....

It could pull a 2170, but not easy to launch. I ran a V967/3, but I am not sure if it was stock, and it wasn't very fast or nice to drive.

H50's are my prop of choice at the moment, very fast on course and launches well, handles nice too.

Had problems with my fuel filter tho, see fuel cell post. :-

And I crashed the boat into a concrete jetty (at idle, but still on plane) and broke a boom :'(

The mono was slow but steady and reliable. ;D

Nitrocrazed racing: Speed thrills!
 
Ian... driving them is easy... close your eyes - turn right!!!

gotta get a few more props now... I only have the one H50 with a bit of extra pitch.. probably need a stock one now...

then again I also need to solve one problem at a time.... get the engine really firing first.... :)

EMS Racing
 
Craig,

Well, I didn't close my eyes, but i was lining up bouy 1 and just turning, I would only see bouy 2 and 3 as I passed them, I was missing them by pure luck! They werent bright in colour tho, and at that speed I couldn't see them.... Scary. :eek:

The guys I was running with thought their area was pretty big until I started running on it!

Did you run the A45?

Tim,

Not even close! It is still tabbed down hard from Sydney so it is slow but is driving great! Didn't get a chance to pull those inside tabs off yet. The boat runs so nice now I dont want to change it. :-

Ian.
 
Tim,

Radio tabs, I can do it on the fly! ;D

I I get a chance to test between now and then I will pull the inner tabs off completely and see if I can still keep the boat on the water.

I kept blowing water lines off the rigger too, they were held on with zip-ties and still blowing! No cowl problems tho after I copied Craigs ultra simple cowl locks! 8)

Nitrocrazed racing: Now I know why Dale shakes.....
 
Ian... copying me??? which boat??

I was going to run the 45 but it wasnt assembled... it was an impulsive run and only my X Hydro and A mono were ready to run..

Will concentrate on the 45 nest time.

Oh and how do you think I felt running a 67 canard in that little circular pond... I was a nervous wreck after that!!!

EMS Racing
 
Craig,

I copied your 45 SG cowl locks.....

You ran your 67 hydro in the round pond (Multi water) over here? hehe! : :) I ran my petrol mono in there twice (84k boat), that was pretty scary!!!! Never again.....

Ian.
 
Ian,

Yep... My Picco 67 Wizard... ask some of the old timers in your club... I was famous for that stunt for years!!!

EMS Racing
 
Craig,

The club has banned members from running oval boats and boats with engines 45 or larger in there! Too dangerous! I bet you thought you were doing 100mph in there tho.... :p

I will see if the Leigh's or Mike Joseph remmember the incident... 8)

Ian.
 
Ian,

I'll do the calc asap, I have to put the exhaust port on to paper.

The V180 I was thinking of getting has got the flick, it is not a serious race engine, looks like a design to be different for the sake of it.

So I've started work on a prototype engine that will have around 15-16hp. If it works well I would like to make it available to others. How absurd does $3000-$3500 sound? Is anyone out there who would pay that much for an engine considering its weight of around 2.2kg?

What sort of drive would I need for 16hp @ 25000rpm, could I use a flex drive if so what size? Also is there a surface prop for this sort of power, if so what is it?
 
Hey Mark,

Ian and I have been looking into the possibility of building a proto 30cc. Ian is the CAD drawing master and we have been talking about this project off line for a few weeks now. One of the key issues into making a big block is first of all discovering / overcoming the rpm limitation in the biggest glow engine that Ian has - the A100. I do not think it is a mechanical limitation such as a strength issue.

I think with the sort of power a large displacement engine will produce, we can afford to sacrifice some torque in the chase for RPM's. Rev's are more usable than huge amounts of torque (which the thing will have anyway). Makes prop selection and boat setup / handling more user friendly.

Ian,

what do you think, should I forward a copy of our rantings to Mark? Make it a 3 way discussion?

Tim.
 
Mark,

Thanks. I also have the same info on the K-90, but I dont have tacho readings of it, so I dont know what revs it runs.

The A180V is based upon the same pistons, liners and rods used in the A-90HP. It has a single carb which feeds a chamber which has a disc at each end which goes into the case volume of each cylinder. The disc timings are 180 degrees each and set 180 degrees apart. This would limit max power, but everything else about the engine is built to race. I didn't get much running with mine, but even running way too lean (it would not richen up with the needle all the way out) it got up on pipe on a 8015 prop shop when mounted in a rigger. The engine would make good power if it could get enough fuel, and it revved very well.

Props are a limiting factor with the larger engines. Prop shop make some very large props (I have heard or 95mm props and own an 8517) but these tend to suit monos. The largest octura is a X482, (and a 3 blade version) which would suit monos okay, but may not be much good on a rigger. The largest hydroplane type prop from Octura would be a P775 or 1475, but neither of these would absorb the sort of power we are talking about.

There are other options for making props that I have not fully explored yet.

Are you talking about a multi cylinder engine to get 25000 rpm? My guess is the engine would have to show as pretty dominant for people to consider paying $3000 or more for. I presume you mean Aussie dollars? I am thinking about 12-14 hp from 20k to 22k would be realistic.

Tim,

I am still betting the problem is the 16% larger capacity in basically the same engine. Give me some time and I can do some testing to confirm my theory, but I am very busy at the moment. :(

What do you mean a strength issue?

Some of what has been said in that discussion is not that politically correct and may not be suitable for public consumption! ;)

I would like to keep as much of the design discussion public as we can, that way we are open to the ideas of the boating community! There's no real secrets in engine design. Besides if someone or an engine company copies our ideas and makes another engine it is actually to our benefit! 8)

Ian.
 
Mark...

Keep me informed whether you want a 180 or not. If you dont want it I will remove it from the order... I am finalising my order this week so please confirm one way or the other.

Craig

EMS Racing
 
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