A New Concept

[Nigtmare]

After many years out of the hobby I came back bringing my 13 year old boy in to it. Mathhew has alot of energy and alot of ideas.About 2 months ago he said to me why there no riggers with the fuel tanks in the sponsons and that will be a good idea.I had to think about it for well and then i asked him what did he have in his mind?He sat down and drew a sponson with the tanks at the back of the sponson totaled accessable I thought that was a good idea so we went ahead and got the consept going the boat is now almost finished we are just waiting for the new Nova rossi to come and then it's test time!!!!!!! I hope it works,Matthew is very happy with his new boat and he hopes that his idea takes the hobby to a new level with the tanks weight been at the boats c/g and the weight been out at the sponsons maybe the boat will be much more stable and easy to handel.well I will keep you guys and gals posted hope the weather stays warm for another month or so to do some testing.Thanks Intlwater for letting me reveal my sons boat here NIck.

 

[Pennywizz6]

Awesome! Im not big into riggers, but in my little theoretical head the fuel in the sponsons may add too much weight causeing the front to drag. And when the fuel drops performance would change. But what do i know ive never ran a rigger!

On the other hand, I am 15, and too have come up with many ideas and run 2 different businesses in CNC machining for RC parts and the other one is computer parts company. Encourage him to make and test out different ideas. He will be making big bucks soon!

Phil B)

 

[Nigtmare]

Here is a site to see some pics. http://community.webshots.com/scripts/edit...bumID=196208859

 

[MarkScott]

Tried to look at the pics, got this back:

An error has occurred.

You do not appear to be the owner of this album.

Make sure you are logged in.

Mark....

 

[Ken Hildreth]

I got the same reply, My only concern would be the length of the fuel line. that seems like a lot of line from the inside sponson to the carb. But I have seen some long lined fuel set ups before. Good luck it would be cool to see a new design rigger, would like to see the pics though. Ken

 

[Nigtmare]

ok here we go again try this! :blink:

http://community.webshots.com/scripts/controlPanel.fcgi

http://community.webshots.com/user/mrcool_rsss350

 

[Preston_Hall]

The problems I would expect are

1) Having to remove fuel equally from each sponson

2) If you have a little accident you are much more likely to be out of the race

3) Cost, sponson set already $100+, need 2 tanks, bad tank=bad sponson and vice versa

4) Fuel cells being more outward would also see more aggitation

5) There would be nothing to go in the tub between the boom tubes

 

[Brian MAhoney]

The problems I would expect are1) Having to remove fuel equally from each sponson

2) If you have a little accident you are much more likely to be out of the race

3) Cost, sponson set already $100+, need 2 tanks, bad tank=bad sponson and vice versa

4) Fuel cells being more outward would also see more aggitation

5) There would be nothing to go in the tub between the boom tubes 

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I've run a few monos and a sport hydro with multiple tanks, I'd give it a go. From Preston's list.

1) I've had no problems, though things may be a bit more extreme in a hydro.

2) Cannot comment, my accidents don't happen to be little though.

3) It's a home build so not an issue.

4) Use a header tank in the tub or even better see 5)

5) Use a float chamber rather than a header tank. Pressurise the fuel system to get the fuel to the float chamber. This should give very consistent needle on the engine for all fuel levels.

Finally as I am an optimist, make provision to move the tank to the tub section.

Brian

 

[Preston_Hall]

The problems I would expect are1) Having to remove fuel equally from each sponson

2) If you have a little accident you are much more likely to be out of the race

3) Cost, sponson set already $100+, need 2 tanks, bad tank=bad sponson and vice versa

4) Fuel cells being more outward would also see more aggitation

5) There would be nothing to go in the tub between the boom tubes 

67693[/snapback]

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I've run a few monos and a sport hydro with multiple tanks, I'd give it a go. From Preston's list.

1) I've had no problems, though things may be a bit more extreme in a hydro.

2) Cannot comment, my accidents don't happen to be little though.

3) It's a home build so not an issue.

4) Use a header tank in the tub or even better see 5)

5) Use a float chamber rather than a header tank. Pressurise the fuel system to get the fuel to the float chamber. This should give very consistent needle on the engine for all fuel levels.

Finally as I am an optimist, make provision to move the tank to the tub section.

Brian

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Extra clarity:

1) In a 21 hydro, for example, I really don't think it is a good idea to ease up to the maximum weight difference between sponsons being 4oz fuel. Hard enough getting a setup for a consistant weight change on the sonsons.

2) Accidents would be potentially more severe since you are hanging your fuel tanks out the side of the boat. Kind of like open wheel race cars.

3) Only if it's home built.

4) 3 tanks now

5) see 4

Now, what I would like to see is for someone to develop a sytem that was mentioned to me. Vision a normal tank with a colapsable bladder inside. The bladder is for fuel. Then using water pressure from the rudder to take the place of the pressure from the exhaust the bladder will colapse and feed fuel to the engine. While doing this you have basically displaced fuel with water. This would keep the balance, CG, of the boat almost the same for the entire race. This would be a drastic advantage as compared to replacing fuel weight with air (zero). The pressure difference between exhaust and cooling systems would of course be different but focus on the tank idea for now.

 

[Heartbeat]

Preston,

I seen something like you described in a mono, But used two side tanks to for the water.

Same guy also had a tank in the nose of a mono to adjust the CG for conditions.

Mike

 

[Grimracer]

Roll center would change dramatically.. not good. It would also be sluggish going into and out of the corners.

Grim

 

[TomMoorehouse]

that tub looks very simmilar to my firefighter's

 

[Watercadet]

Preston that idea sounds like a good one. Why don't you try it? The water would keep the fuel cold too...

Adam

 

[outboardman10]

What about on an accident when the tubes get ripped open! you will have fuel everywhere and then we could be kicked out of the pond. That would NOT BE GOOD.

 

[wswatzell]

Weather it works, or doesn't work, I admire the effort & thinking "outside the box” You can have all the theories in the world, of why something might work, or not work, but until you try, you never really know for sure. I would defiantly take note of the concerns brought up, & then take special notice of things when testing to see if in reality they are a concern or not. Good Luck!

BTW, I really like the color scheme. Very nice!

 

[Nigtmare]

OK. i see that the subject has opened up a new can of worms! thanks for all the replies and all the suggestions. i do keep notes for all that has been said so when test time comes, i'll have something to go with! Tom, you are right, the tub does look like yours. as you know, i live in Barrie and climate boats is just down the street from me and i also own a Firefighter 21 for a yr. the tub does look like yours but it's longer at the back, shorter at the front and the angles, they are totally different. also, the bulkhead has been moved farther back and the transom is similar to the Roadrunner. this boat has a little bit of everything. if it does work, some of the credit can go to your part of the tub!!! now, going back to the idea of having the tanks at the sponsons. if you take a 2x4 eight feet long, and you balance it at the center, and then you add bricks at the balancing point, the C/G, it will not change. whether you add or subtract the weight, the C/G remains the same! at least thats the way i see it. having the fuel transfering from the left to the right, it will keep the boat stable with the right sponson heavier all the way to the end of the race and the C/G will remain the same. having the weight at the outside of the boat, the torque of the engine and the prop will not have the effect of twisting the boat as much. just like ford when they move the shocks to the outside of the frame on their trucks !!! i know that the sponsons look big, and they are on the big side, but they can be made much smaller and much slimmer. i guess i will have to try what i got and see where we are at. matthew thinks that his new concept is good as bread to butter, and there's nothing i cant tell him or anyone else in that matter!!! that his boat just might end up being "a nightmare"!!!!!!!! the name says it all !!!!! :lol: keep writing with all your help, we might end up with something that we can take to the races- or a very good anchor for our pond-...!!! h34r: i have posted some new pics. and i will take some more suggestions and critisim with my head up!! thanks, Nick

 

[Nigtmare]

ok here we go again try this! :blink:                                                       http://community.webshots.com/scripts/controlPanel.fcgi

http://community.webshots.com/user/mrcool_rsss350

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We were actually thinking of putting a barbie doll between the boom tubes. :lol:

 

[Nigtmare]

The problems I would expect are1) Having to remove fuel equally from each sponson

2) If you have a little accident you are much more likely to be out of the race

3) Cost, sponson set already $100+, need 2 tanks, bad tank=bad sponson and vice versa

4) Fuel cells being more outward would also see more aggitation

5) There would be nothing to go in the tub between the boom tubes 

67693[/snapback]

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sry i wrote it in the wrong place¿ we were actually thinking of straping a barbie doll between the boom tubes :lol:

 

[Brad Christy]

Nightmare,

Transferring the fuel from the lft tank to the right, may seem like a good idea until you really think about it. It's hard enough to get these boats to run the same at the start of the race and at the end of the race, due to the change in CG from front to back. Now you're talking about shifting it from center to way out to the right. The boat will start to pull to the right as the CG transfers, and this will continue to increase until you are out of fuel in the left tank. It's hard enough trying to stay off the bouy's with a boat that runs straight, let alone if it start to increasingly pull to the right. You have to maintain equal tank levels throughout the run.

The Barbie doll is a cute thought, though..........

Thanks. Brad.

Titan Racing Components

 

[Dorkhedeos]

if the tubes rip open, all you gotta do is throw a match into the pond and you will have a smoke show :lol: