Pictures needed

[kcvnd]

As the title says I need some good detail shots of the Pak. In particular I would like some shots of the transom/rudder, turn fin, and cockpit.

Thanks guys I appreciate the help!

Cheers

Kevin

 

[Joe Wiebelhaus]

Just to be clear, the 69 outrigger hull ?

if so, send me an e-mail

 

[Mike Luszcz]

Joe, its the outrigger hull. I did the CAD/ Laser design for the kits:

 

[Mike Luszcz]

Kevin, you might enjoy these pics when you get the 82 Atlas framing kit. He is cutting it today. Mike

http://thunderboats.smugmug.com/2004/Fall-Exhibition-Seattle-WA/1917122_6w3uX#96942246_4X3fr

 

[kcvnd]

Kevin, you might enjoy these pics when you get the 82 Atlas framing kit. He is cutting it today. Mike

http://thunderboats.smugmug.com/2004/Fall-Exhibition-Seattle-WA/1917122_6w3uX#96942246_4X3fr

Thanks Mike.

I am hoping to get started on the three PAK's soon. I want to get some details to get some custom hardware for them in my usual style. This should be fun building three at once.

Cheers,

Kev

The Atlas will be a great are you shipping the third PAK kit with it when it comes?

 

[Mike Luszcz]

Yup, the 3rd PAK will come with the Atlas. I have about half of the Thriftway2 plans done. Been working on and off with those, but I figured you are not in a hurry just yet for those! lol. I gotta get Phil Thomas's Gas 8255 plans done too! I will keep you updated.

 

[dave weagel]

michael,

congratulations and thank you for making your beautiful laser cut scale kits available. i am interested in the phil thomas 82U55 gas kit.

what are dimensions of this hull ?

will this kit be available directly from you or do i have to order it from phil ?

will there be a "scale" cowl available that will fit around and over the gas engine ?

will a rear exhaust gas engine be required to fit inside the "scale" cowl ?

when will the framing kits be available ?

thank you,

dave weagel

 

[Mike Luszcz]

Dave, I am working on the gas version of the 8255 Gas hull right now. I had put it off for a couple weeks, but I really need to get it finished up for Phil soon. I think Phil will probably be taking my framing/ sheeting kit, and making a plug out of it, and then making the glass hull available. I have not asked to much about it yet as far as his future plans. I will be able to offer the wood framing kit, and a sheeting kit for it. The size is somewhere around 51" long, engine well of 6" wide, air trap width of 14-15/32" wide and a total width of 27-17/32" and I have really not thought about the cowling as I figure Phil will make a plug when he gets to building on it. You might want to contact him, and see if he will be doing a glass version, might work out better if you like glass boats more. PM me if you have any more questions, and I will be glad to help answer them. Mike

Oh, as far as the Gas engine fitment, I only run FE, so I could not tell you what will need to be done for exhaust fitment. I do know with a 6" wide engine well, there should be MORE than enough room to do whatever you need inside! I have tons of room in my '82 Executone hull!

 

[dave weagel]

michael,

thank you for the detailed reply to my questions. the 8255 hull is a great choice for a gas scale. your hull dimensions seem to indicate a 1/6 scale hull and should provide plenty of room for both styles of gas engines.

i hope you will offer a laser cut wood kit for these plans but i can understand the situation if phil wants to market an epoxy glass hull exclusively. a framing kit and scale cowl would be a nice option for wood builders.

please consider a newton 108 or 109 1/6 gas scale wood kit. if you offer the kits i think someone will make the cowls available.

thank you,

dave

 

[dave weagel]

michael,

i'm sending you a PM regarding the 8255 gas hull kit.

thank you,

dave

 

[Mike Luszcz]

Dave, Phil never asked for having this set exclusively. If he did, I would have to ask him for $50 an hour design time since I would never make anything in the future on the framing. I will do anything for anyone if they want it to be theirs alone, but it would come at a price! I definitely loose a lot of money in the time it takes to draw up everything as I offer the kits at a pretty fair price, at least I think so when you look at the time it takes to hand cut out a full framing kit, and fit it. If you think about it that way, its a steal!!! haha. I really am doing these kits just for the fun of it. Sure, some extra money would be cool, but I enjoy the drafting, and enjoy seeing a kit come back from the laser cutters fitting correctly, and knowing the person getting that kit will be building one heck of a nice boat! I will look and see what the 108 and 109 hull is and PM you that info. I am gonna check your PM now. Talk soon, Mike

 

[Hydro Junkie]

The 108 hull is three basic designs:

The 7325 hull Pay'N Pak

The 7025 hull Cabover Pay'N Pak and the variations thereof

The 7025 hull with the center of the boat notched out in the engine bay like in the Red Man cabover(?)

The difference between the 7025 and 7325 is at the transom, the 7325 has a flat topped transom while the 7025 is arched. The big problem is that there are several different boats that are almost identical except for picklefork depth. The ones that come to mind first are the 7207 Notre Dame and the 7474 Value Mart. The difference between these two boats is the picklefork depth and length of the aft cowling. Juist something to think about.

The 109 plan only makes four boats, the 74 Miss US being the first

 

[dave weagel]

hj,

thank you for posting clarifications about the 108 hulls. i'd suggest that mike base his CAD design on the most common bulkhead template and framing sheets that david has. that rules out the cab forward and "notched" boats.

i think that david could quickly find the sheets that make the most boats. i forget that mike is making actual 1/8 scale hulls and i tend to lump most of the 108s into one basic hull. i don't know if roger drew different sheets for every variation but the bulkhead and framing sheets that he sent with my '72 notre dame paint sheet appears to show "generic" 108 of sorts except for notations about the transoms which he does show at least 2 transom templates as i recall.

other than that i assumed that he only drew one set of bulkhead and framing sheets. i guess david would have to confirm if mike wants to go with this design. i like the 108 because it makes so many different boats with mostly minor differences but i'm not a scale expert . i just like that classic early picklefork with rear cockpit and full cowl like '72 notre dame.

maybe there are too many variations to deal with for scale builds. what i was really hoping for was a gas version enlarged to 1/6 scale.

regarding the 109 hull, true only 4 boats but it's another nice clean design with a relatively simple cowl which would scale up to 1/6 nicely in my opinion. there are several others that would be good gas scale candidates, the 108 and 109 are among my personal favorites. can't think of the other mhr numbers at the moment.

i see that steve g. chose to mold the 7474 hull recently which may be best choice for a sort of "generic" 108. just a suggestion for mike to consider.

thank you hj and mike,

dave

 

[Hydro Junkie]

Roger drew one set of plans that makes all the various 108 boats of the above listed types. What Mike can do is to draw up the transom for the 7325 and have the arched top marked so the builder can make the changes as needed for either the arched or notched transoms. That would also be the same with the sponson insides as the one drawn on the plan is actually for the boats with the arched top transom, so it doesn't line up with the top of the flat topped transom. Since the picklefork depth is set by where the bow block is placed, Mike might be best served to include a wood block that is the correct width to fit between the sponson insides and call it good. Also, I would recommend a non-hull specific deck and nontrips in the skin set(if made)as these two parts will vary depending on the boat chosen.

 

[dave weagel]

h j,

thank you again for the detailed information. you've offered the solution to the question about how to make an accurate 108 kit if mike wants to proceed. as i said, i suggested the 108 because i am hoping that the CAD plans can be scaled up to make a gas hull.

as usual the cowls would be a problem for the larger hull but maybe someome in the 1/6 gas scale group would make the correctly sized full length "needle nosed" cowl available once the kits are produced.

and you confirmed that roger did draw only the one set of template and framing sheets. obviously, the practical way to make a useful plan set readily available. roger produced an amazing collection of drawings and michael is making a great contribution by producing them in CAD form making kit cutting much more practical for more builders.

cutting parts from templates is a major project in itself, then the fitting begins. i suppose that's model building 101. luckily mike has now eliminated most of that pain.

i'm not a scale builder so i'm not familiar with how "strict" the scale judges are at a scale race measuring a boat hull and comparing with the MHR specs. i guess that's what scale competition is about.

regardless, the 8255 gas hull kit is a great start for gas hydro builders and the new rear exhaust gas engines now make gas "scale" pickleforks a reasonable possibility. i think that the sanctioning organizations will change their gas thunderboat rules to include piston era pickleforks which will encourage builders to make more realistic looking gas hydros. the round nose t-boat class is saturated, it's time to include the early pickleforks.

this stuff is interesting and fun but seems to generate a certain level of insanity at times like everything else nowadays.

my $ 0.02

 

[P THOMAS]

regardless, the 8255 gas hull kit is a great start for gas hydro builders and the new rear exhaust gas engines now make gas "scale" pickleforks a reasonable possibility. i think that the sanctioning organizations will change their gas thunderboat rules to include piston era pickleforks which will encourage builders to make more realistic looking gas hydros. the round nose t-boat class is saturated, it's time to include the early pickleforks.

this stuff is interesting and fun but seems to generate a certain level of insanity at times like everything else nowadays.

my $ 0.02

yes I willhave to give one a go. Insanity is fine, just need a bunch of nuts to build boats

 

[Hydro Junkie]

Phil, I don't know about you but I've never known any R/C hydro driver, especially in the scale ranks, that didn't have a few nuts and bolts loose between the ears. To take the time it requires to build an accurate scale boat is something that borders on insanity. Don't ask me how I know or understand this :lol:

Dave, the 108 is a great plan for scaling up. Years ago, Roger tried to start a class of 1/6th scale gassers in the Northwest. The problems found were the engines weren't powerful enough and the costs were too high. With today's more powerful engines, you can scale up a 108 to 120% for a T-boat or 134% for a 1/6th scale. If you do go to 1/6th, you will need to add aditional bulkheads between the ones on the plan as stringers and/or just the skin isn't ridgid enough.

 

[dave weagel]

h j and phil,

good advice re the 108 hull, maybe michael will design that feature into the gas version, t-boat or 1/6. to clarify my interest, i'm not really concerned too much about the actual size of the gas hulls as long as it's big enough for the gas engine and exhaust systems. in my opinion, 48-50 length is the practical limit for most boaters factoring in build difficulty , costs , transport and managing the boats at the pond. but i understand that the existing t-boat classes dimensions are established. just need to include the piston era pickleforks now.

re scale nuts and bolts, you guys summed it up perfectly. we must all be insane to be in this hobby.

dave

 

[Mike Luszcz]

Im out of town for a wedding in PA this weekend, but I will talk to all of you about ideas when I get back monday. Talk soon, Mike

 

[Hydro Junkie]

Mike, I'll be home all day Monday as far as I know if you want to "chat". If you would rather talk on the phone, let me know