Just a question

[Roger Hooks Jr.]

Grim Racer okay...

I am saying this laughingly...

You have to explain this one to me and everyone else that has been taken out of race by a less than stellar driver because they could not or would hold there lane.

"Also. I don’t (just me) feel like racing “the Best” makes for “better racing”.

Not to say everyone doesn't have their share of mishaps but...

Depending on how people rate who they would consider the best it would seem that you have won a lot of races which would probably mean they were not all easy races, which would probably mean you can drive well with good driver's intuition... I don't know how many times someone has said... "I like to race you because you can hold your lane"

This seems to make for a good 6 laps (or 5 laps depending on your program) of deck to deck racing not 3 laps and a DSQ and parts spread all over turn two. So wouldn't that consistute better racing?

Or

Were you referring to the overal event experience?

This "IS" a bit off topic but just had to comment.

 

[Grimracer]

Maybe that isn't the best way to put it but the best way I can think of in such a short sentence.
I am just curious.... and please do not use this post to bash one side against the other. I have just observed a few things over the years which makes me ask a few questions and being the person that I am I rather go to the source rather than speculate or ask people who are not IMPBA members.

I know for myself and many NAMBA members that we are not opposed to racing in National event from coast to coast or organization to organization. I myself have raced from LA to New York and many places in between. This is the case with many NAMBA members that I know of but it seems that traveling is much more of a hinderance for East Coast guys and I wonder why. On average I don't think anyone of us is anymore well off than the other so I don't think affluence is an issue. I also see west coast NAMBA boaters go to east coast IMPBA events but don't see many if any IMPBA guys come westward... And when I did go to New York I thought I would have a chance tor race against some of the hot shot East Coast IMPBA guys but didn't see many if any. Actually in my most favorite class at the time, 60 hydro, my competition was the same guys I raced here in California at most every nats. As a matter of fact we were 1, 2, 3.

Now I know that there is the difference between the Nationals racing format but I am wondering if it is really that critical. Keep in mind I am all for stiff competition and I see the US-1 format as a good challenge but it is it that important to forgoe a chance to race with guys (good racers) you may never get to race again? No matter what the race is, if it is from point A to point B and everyone has to run the same race, Isn't still a race worth winning?

I guess I am putting this out there because I would like to see more coast to coast racing. I know times are tough but just something to keep in mind when times get better. I have had some stellar racing days but even in those best days I always wonder if I really raced the best around or was it just a day at being the big fish in a little pond.

Just thoughts.

What do you think?

Roger,

Your asking.. so Im saying…

Just reading the topic, that is the silliest question I have ever read on here.. Its like the new guys on the mass message boards.. Whats better.. this boat or that boat.. Your right that did not come off “the best way” at all.. not to me anyway…

Seems to me your first question is merely observation based on an opinion.. you have no facts that the west cost is more willing to travel then the east. I did not see one NAMBA west coaster at the Tunnel Worlds!.. so……….. or our internats last year!....

Why should ones organizations format and or history forgo their format… how about embracing it and take on the challenge! NAMBA to IMPBA and IMPBA to NAMBA.. same but different challenge…

I think…We all would like to see more coast to coast racing.. BUT.. Unless you have the money to fly.. driving to a west cost/or east cost event is a daunting task. Is it worth it to most? Not just a few (the guys you placed 1,2 and 3 with) but most?

Na…

Realistically its a matter of distance, time, cost and value.

Also. I don’t (just me) feel like racing “the Best” makes for “better racing”. Its nice to have fast guys around cus they make you faster but does it really make better racing? Maybe.. but not to me.. I like good racers.. I like bad racers.. I just like racing…….. I also don’t feel that a LARGE race makes racing better either.. some of the best racing (personally) I have ever been involved in were races with about 30 dudes just having a BLAST racing toy boats..

I have raced at large events and small.. I have raced with the best and the worst..

I really just want to play with my boats and make good friends and shake the hands of old ones.

Grimracer

I think we have both shared some opinion not based on fact that can also provide the component for an interesting discussion. One could always choose less-than-complimentary words to describe the opinion about one other's point of view, but that would really pose a threat to pulling this topic off track. I was just curious to hear what other people had to say and I offered my point of view to open the dialogue. Thank you for offering your perspective. I made no mention of big race, small race, or forgoing tradition and I also digressed from the topic subhead in the firs line. I believe my position was only to get a better understanding of what others think?

aha.. and you got it!

 

[John Knight]

Roger,

I honestly believe the answer to your question is based upon distance, economics and what each of us is looking to come out our races. All factor into the equation, especially the economics now.

Distance -

NAMBA is primarily on the west coast except for FLA. I am in the middle of IMPBA here in the southeast/middle atlantic. The racers that come to our races here in Charleston are a mix of IMPBA (mostly) and NAMBA (FLA mostly). Some are both.

The Charleston club puts on two national races, the World Tunnel Championships and the Fall Nationals. The tunnel champs race draws from all around the country but are primarily IMPBA. Jerry Dunlap has been gracious enough to attend each of our tunnel champs but he is the only NAMBA racer from the west coast that has attended. As for the Fall Nationals, it is drawing from the east to mid west areas.

Economics -

Most of us have very few excess or disposable $$$ to go to the other coast. Not that we don't want to the funds are not there.

Race desire & outcome -

Some are not looking for national recognition or those type awards. They are looking for the "FUN" factor at the races. At times if that takes finishing outside the top 10 and enjoying the race more than one that you work yourself to the bone for a piece of wood or plastic and had little fun, which one is more important. I have won 151 trophies and awards at races but I have concentrated on the fun factor for quite a long while. While the awards keep coming, the fun and enjoyment has increased significantly. The overall racing experience as you noted is more valuable in my opinion.

It comes down to there are two primary racing associations that are largely geographically separated. I enjoy the folks at the races as much as the racing itself. It has nothing to do with the two associations. However, I am with Marty Davis in that we should have ONE and ONLY one racing association. The goals and the needs are exactly the same. We would be immensely stronger and better off for everyone. The obstacle is politics in my opinion.

 

[Grimracer]

Grim Racer okay...
I am saying this laughingly...

You have to explain this one to me and everyone else that has been taken out of race by a less than stellar driver because they could not or would hold there lane.

"Also. I don’t (just me) feel like racing “the Best” makes for “better racing”.

Not to say everyone doesn't have their share of mishaps but...

Depending on how people rate who they would consider the best it would seem that you have won a lot of races which would probably mean they were not all easy races, which would probably mean you can drive well with good driver's intuition... I don't know how many times someone has said... "I like to race you because you can hold your lane"

This seems to make for a good 6 laps (or 5 laps depending on your program) of deck to deck racing not 3 laps and a DSQ and parts spread all over turn two. So wouldn't that consistute better racing?

Or

Were you referring to the overall event experience?

This "IS" a bit off topic but just had to comment.

Roger.. lets do this.. let me explain what I meant to you. Others will read but cuz they are not asking im thinking its just you that wants to know my view..

I said NOTIHING about being taken out by a lesser driver.. truth is I can not EVER remember that happening to me.. but.. OK lets say for the sake of conversation it has happen to me…maybe it has.. I am after all getting older!..lol

My answer is!!!!!.. O well…. I can say I have been stuffed on launch,, douched on the last lap and good old had my arrs kicked by rookies as well as past national champions.. and guess what.. its still “O well” to me..

My view stands based on my opinion.. that is what you asked for…

Racing RC boats IS.. winning and loosing…. To me it’s a hobby not a sport.. I don’t feel the national orgs should merge.. blaha blaha... its my view and opinion… I bet your thinking.. O well!.. hahahha..

Let me qualify that as.. A better event experience.. I like to get side by side with the others but what I really want is a better or “best” overall racing experience.. Most of the time it’s the pace of the event,, the host club and the nice people that MAKE the race… at the same time we always get into a few realy good heats.. Right Tom David!.. a great racer in his own right... hea.. he is a good buddy too!

And to your last question.. na.. not me….I find it just as much fun to drive traffic as I do deck to deck with…aha.. the “good driver”.. its like.. Whow… LOOK OUT!.. hehehe Fun stuff.. Or how about the first time a new guys “latches on” and drives like a pro.. only to make one tiny mistake and you win.. My Indiana friends know what im talking about… AS GOOD AS ANY deck to deck race I have been in.. win or loose..

So there you have it.. I beat to a different drum.. Im sorry if I do not take this as serious as you?.. or others but its just my deal..

If I get upset at a race its typically because of my sight or some stupid mechanical mistake I have made...... ask anybody if they have ever seen me loose my cool at a race.. bet ya can not find one…. Me getting upset is like.. O well!... hahah

I DO NOT and WILL not race for money or prizes.. (as the motivator)

I love racing RC boats as a HOBBY

I love to meet new racers as well as old ones

I love the history of the RC boat hobby as well as the overall hobby.. (I have a Antique hobby shop in my home. cases, cash register and all! TRUE!)

ROCK ON

Grim

 

[Mark Poole ModVP]

When BOTH oganizations were formed, the people that formed them knew the importance of DISTRICTS. This is a hobby. The idea was for everyone to be able to race against a good quantity and quality of competition without having to drive all over the country to do it. I firmly believe they had this in mind when the "Fostering of Model Boating" statement was put on the first page of the rule book. More and more clubs are turning away from this basic principle for fostering the hobby (and why?), especially in these economic times. How do you expect to get more people on board when they see a large number of members and their home clubs travelling out of district and several states over to race four, five, six times a year instead of staying home and playing in their own district? And, then when the BIG race comes around, the INTERNATS, it almost gets cancelled from lack of entries. (Glad to see another club pick up the flag and run with it!) Is good quality district racing and one or two big races not enough for you?

People talk about having fun but I don't see that like I used to when I got into this. The most fun I ever had was with the old Savannah club that had a fun run once a month and put on one sanctioned race a year. Even if I could I'm not travelling coast to coast to race model boats. It's a hobby.

 

[darby96]

Roger

come down to the pits this weekend and we can talk at great length. I plan on being down there all day

don't feel like walking up & down the hill a hundred plus times.

As said before each oranization has its own merits and yes should be kept separate, but think of it a race

with the best of all organizations whow what fun and commorarity we can have. A great meal and friends

to enjoy it with on one of the nites, stories by the lake site. Just think the first liar would never have a chance.

East coast west coast who cares just have it in the middle some where. if we put our minds to it, we could do it...

By the way even though I am a NAMBA member, and wuld never change I do Like the US1 format better.

my many cents worth

DaveB

NAMBA 98

HOF Member

 

[Roger Hooks Jr.]

Grim Racer okay...
I am saying this laughingly...

You have to explain this one to me and everyone else that has been taken out of race by a less than stellar driver because they could not or would hold there lane.

"Also. I don’t (just me) feel like racing “the Best” makes for “better racing”.

Not to say everyone doesn't have their share of mishaps but...

Depending on how people rate who they would consider the best it would seem that you have won a lot of races which would probably mean they were not all easy races, which would probably mean you can drive well with good driver's intuition... I don't know how many times someone has said... "I like to race you because you can hold your lane"

This seems to make for a good 6 laps (or 5 laps depending on your program) of deck to deck racing not 3 laps and a DSQ and parts spread all over turn two. So wouldn't that consistute better racing?

Or

Were you referring to the overall event experience?

This "IS" a bit off topic but just had to comment.

Roger.. lets do this.. let me explain what I meant to you. Others will read but cuz they are not asking im thinking its just you that wants to know my view..

I said NOTIHING about being taken out by a lesser driver.. truth is I can not EVER remember that happening to me.. but.. OK lets say for the sake of conversation it has happen to me…maybe it has.. I am after all getting older!..lol

My answer is!!!!!.. O well…. I can say I have been stuffed on launch,, douched on the last lap and good old had my arrs kicked by rookies as well as past national champions.. and guess what.. its still “O well” to me..

My view stands based on my opinion.. that is what you asked for…

Racing RC boats IS.. winning and loosing…. To me it’s a hobby not a sport.. I don’t feel the national orgs should merge.. blaha blaha... its my view and opinion… I bet your thinking.. O well!.. hahahha..

Let me qualify that as.. A better event experience.. I like to get side by side with the others but what I really want is a better or “best” overall racing experience.. Most of the time it’s the pace of the event,, the host club and the nice people that MAKE the race… at the same time we always get into a few realy good heats.. Right Tom David!.. a great racer in his own right... hea.. he is a good buddy too!

And to your last question.. na.. not me….I find it just as much fun to drive traffic as I do deck to deck with…aha.. the “good driver”.. its like.. Whow… LOOK OUT!.. hehehe Fun stuff.. Or how about the first time a new guys “latches on” and drives like a pro.. only to make one tiny mistake and you win.. My Indiana friends know what im talking about… AS GOOD AS ANY deck to deck race I have been in.. win or loose..

So there you have it.. I beat to a different drum.. Im sorry if I do not take this as serious as you?.. or others but its just my deal..

If I get upset at a race its typically because of my sight or some stupid mechanical mistake I have made...... ask anybody if they have ever seen me loose my cool at a race.. bet ya can not find one…. Me getting upset is like.. O well!... hahah

I DO NOT and WILL not race for money or prizes.. (as the motivator)

I love racing RC boats as a HOBBY

I love to meet new racers as well as old ones

I love the history of the RC boat hobby as well as the overall hobby.. (I have a Antique hobby shop in my home. cases, cash register and all! TRUE!)

ROCK ON

Grim

LOL! I think everyone that knows (actually met me... and my dad) is reading your post and knows that you have never met me. If you had you would know that "O Well" is pretty much how I look at the racing whole experience. It probably amazes you that a person can still love to compete as much as I do but not get mad when things don't go their way whether my fault, the boats, fault, or whoever's fault. More reason for both of us to get out more. Even then I can still look at this as more of a sport not a hobby. Someone wants said it is a sport because we keep score. A hobby you don't. The whole reason for this post really is to show that we all don't beat to a such a different drum after all.

I got a chuckle from your statement. "I DO NOT and WILL not race for money or prizes.. dot... dot... dot. "(as a motivator)" I am glad you clarified that. LOL!

I too love racing boats as a hobby when I am testing for fun... and as a sport when I am racing for points.

I also love to socialize with my friends in boating but contstantly look for ways to bring new ones

And... the History. I dedicate a race to one of the fore-fathers of our organization and provide boat for his son to race with us every year just to keep the history alive. I have also written articles on the history.

So...

Once again... the more you say to show we are different the more I see us as the same. Which is probably the case for much of all of us.

: )

 

[Roger Hooks Jr.]

When BOTH oganizations were formed, the people that formed them knew the importance of DISTRICTS. This is a hobby. The idea was for everyone to be able to race against a good quantity and quality of competition without having to drive all over the country to do it. I firmly believe they had this in mind when the "Fostering of Model Boating" statement was put on the first page of the rule book. More and more clubs are turning away from this basic principle for fostering the hobby (and why?), especially in these economic times. How do you expect to get more people on board when they see a large number of members and their home clubs travelling out of district and several states over to race four, five, six times a year instead of staying home and playing in their own district? And, then when the BIG race comes around, the INTERNATS, it almost gets cancelled from lack of entries. (Glad to see another club pick up the flag and run with it!) Is good quality district racing and one or two big races not enough for you?
People talk about having fun but I don't see that like I used to when I got into this. The most fun I ever had was with the old Savannah club that had a fun run once a month and put on one sanctioned race a year. Even if I could I'm not travelling coast to coast to race model boats. It's a hobby.

I see your point. Our own district was split up to reduce the amount of traveling. Our district got the best deal in that decision the other district still has large distances to cover. I wasn't talking about traveling all the time... Actually I wasn't trying to say that anyone had to... just why not? So far I see time and money as the primary reason... and that it is a good reason whether it is the only reason or not. I was just asking to hear all of them.

 

[Bill Gibson]

Roger, this has been a VERY interesting topic, although i think that several topics were covered and thats OK by me......i think that the vast majority of folks just dont have the time or money to do what your asking, and im one of em! Ive been a member of both sanctioning bodies for a number of years....never had a problem to speak of with either one. I have never been concerned with being the best simply because i consider what i do to be a hobby... for me if i luck into a top 3 every so often, then thats good enough for me....i enjoy building and finishing probably as much as the racing....that being said....if i had the money, i would plant my 51 year old butt into a full size 5 or 7 litre hydroplane so fast it would make your head spin!! Thats how crazy i am about hydroplane racing! But that i would consider a sport. I respect anyones opinion who calls RC boat racing a sport...but to be totally honest with you ive never really gotten it....guess im a little bit like Grim in that im crazy about so many other aspects of the hobby (sorry) than just the racing...the wonderful characters that ive gotton to know and call my friends, the challange of building and all the decisions that go with it....and yes the racing and doing well at a race once in a while is a heck of alot of fun too! I hope that maybe someday i will have the pleasure of meeting you in person at a race. Bill

 

[Jeff Cowey]

Thanks for the reply Mr Hooks. I have a better understanding of where you are comming from now.

Regards Jeff~

 

[Tom Foley]

When BOTH oganizations were formed, the people that formed them knew the importance of DISTRICTS. This is a hobby. The idea was for everyone to be able to race against a good quantity and quality of competition without having to drive all over the country to do it. I firmly believe they had this in mind when the "Fostering of Model Boating" statement was put on the first page of the rule book. More and more clubs are turning away from this basic principle for fostering the hobby (and why?), especially in these economic times. How do you expect to get more people on board when they see a large number of members and their home clubs travelling out of district and several states over to race four, five, six times a year instead of staying home and playing in their own district? And, then when the BIG race comes around, the INTERNATS, it almost gets cancelled from lack of entries. (Glad to see another club pick up the flag and run with it!) Is good quality district racing and one or two big races not enough for you?
. Even if I could I'm not travelling coast to coast to race model boats. It's a hobby.

Thats it in a nutshell , valuable free time has to be divided many ways ..and RC boating get's only a slice of the pie ......but WAY too much money !!!! I hope to make the Charleston

Fall race ..that will be a big trip for me as far as racing boats goes .