Electric Rules Change Proposals

[Kevin Whitehead]

Here is one way to put some water on all of the overheated rules change discusisions:

NAMBA Official Rulebook

Page 3

10-10 AMENDMENTS

10-13 NO proposals will be submitted for the next calendar year after the September newsletter is published. ALL proposals shall take effect on January 1 of the following year.

Looks like whatever the outcome of the 19-27T vote, it is 27T for this year!

KW

 

[drobie]

Kevin,

You're going to love this one...

The procedure for submitting a rule change was altered many years ago by the board but the rulebook was never updated to reflect the change.

This is how changes have been processed in recent years:

"Racing rule additions, deletions, or changes shall be voted on by the general membership by adherring to the following procedures:    1. Proposed rule changes must be submitted to the district director in the district in which the submitting member resides.

    2. Upon receipt of said proposal, the district director shall put the matter to a vote within his district. This vote can occur at any time during the year as deemed appropriate by the director but should be handled in a timely manner. The exact method of said vote can be handled in whatever manner is normally followed for voting within that particular district.

    3. Upon successful passage of the proposal within the district, the district director shall forward the proposal to the NAMBA office along with a statement by the district director that the proposal has passed within his district and that the district desires to have the proposal sent to the general membership for voting.

    4. Proposals may be submitted to the NAMBA office at any time during the year as long as the previous three steps have been adherred to.

    5. The NAMBA office shall send out the proposal to the membership for voting. The proposal shall normally be sent out with the next regular mailing of the newsletter, but special mailings may be utilized if deemed necessary. In addition, the proposals and ballots may be made available to the membership by publication on the NAMBA web page.

    6. Members shall be given adequate time to receive the ballot, consider the propositions, and cast their votes. Normally a period of 45 days from the date mailed would be considered ample time for this to take place.

    7. Only members in good standing at the time of the vote shall be permitted to vote. All classifications of members will permitted to vote, including adult members, family members, and junior members.

    8. Members shall be permitted to return their votes to the NAMBA office by mail, fax, or email as long as it is able to be adequately determined that the vote is coming from a member in good standing and as long as the vote is received by the voting deadline.   

    9. The NAMBA office shall receive and compile the votes. The NAMBA office may designate another entity to receive and compile the votes should this be deemed necessary.

    10.  The NAMBA office shall inform the membership of the result of the vote by publication in the next newsletter and by publication on the NAMBA web page.

    11. The NAMBA office shall update the appropriate section of the NAMBA rulebook as soon as possible and amended pages shall be sent to all rulebook holders.

    12. Proposals which have been approved will take effect immediately unless it is deemed by the board of directors that such immediate action will have an unfair effect on the members. In such cases, ample time will be given before implementation for the members to comply with the new requirements.

    13. New classes shall be eligible for inclusion in district and national events as soon as they have been approved by the membership. All catagories of NAMBA records may be set in these new classes as soon as the rules have been approved by the membership."

OK, everyone run for cover while Kevin comments on that.

And please don't shoot the messenger.

 

[Kevin Whitehead]

Well, that clarifies what NAMBA stands for.

It must be Nazi American Model Boat Association.

Go ahead, change the rules. But, don't tell the members!

National organization continually letting the membership down.

Electric division forming "secret" committee to decide FE rules changes.

What a crock this whole (dis)organization is!

 

[drobie]

Well, that clarifies what NAMBA stands for.
It must be Nazi American Model Boat Association.

Electric division forming "secret" committee to decide FE rules changes. 

91600[/snapback]

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Yes, but that committee is receiving funding from the Simon Wiesenthal Center.

Relax Kevin you might be pleasantly suprised by the proposal. If not, just vote no with Darin. :blink:

 

[Kevin Whitehead]

I have just kind of laughed with the people who have suggested forming an new FE association, not taking it seriously.

But this. It is just inexcusable, with the dues paying members not getting the slightest trace of common decentcy from the national organization. WE ARE CLEARLY BEING FLEECED!!!!

I would leave today (even if I couldn't get my dues back from this axis of weasels), if there were an equivalent org. in terms of races scheduled.

I for one, would spend any spare time that I have in an effort to start a new organization, one that is responsive to the members, to start next year or at least as soon as manageable.

NAMBA is a bunch of crap.

KW

 

[Al Waters]

What if a NAMBA officer showed up at your FE Nats this year for the week and gave you the opportunity to voice your concerns. Would that show you that they cared?

Al Waters

NAMBA Vice President

NAMBA Scale Unlimited Chairman

 

[jstevens]

KW

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Kevin,

We'll keep the light on for ya!

Jeff

 

[jayt]

I formally invite Kevin to quit NAMBA immediately. If he feels is so dissenfranchized that he has to resort to name calling, then do we really need him? It's just toy boats folks.

The "new" updated rule book has been in the works for years; Cathie told me last night that it should be out in the next couple months. Also, the NAMBA website will be changed considerably in the next few weeks. NAMBA is an organization of volunteers, and getting things done takes time (as anyone with volunteer experience already knows). If we wanted it to be run by professionals, I can head the whining and screaing now when the dues would double or triple......

 

[brooks93]

Speak for yourself Jay..

Kevin is a good guy and a asset to this hobby.. I to have said the same thing before but, decided to try to help fix the FE part of Namba before jumping ship.

we now have 3 districts that we didn't have last year with FE District Directors that are seeking help in making Namba FE better but, we can't do it without help.. We need to know what you want and what you want to see. Most everyone agree's the rules are old and out dated and they need to be updated but, help us do it so we can try and cover all angles.

Kevin no one knows hydro's like you.. Heck you design your own full bodys and they work.. that better then most of us.. Let us know what you want to see.. Help us clear things up

 

[AlanN]

Since I have not stirred the pot any I might as well get my .02 in.

The rules are being written by the few for the many. Yes we get chance to vote on what changes the few want but wouldn't it be better to hold a general discussion 1st? That is if the members can handle such a task.

We have seen what a few people want for rule changes but have had little or no imput on what the majority would like to do.

I have ran Sport Hydros for yrs but noone asked me what my opinion was. I am a NAMBA member and should have some rights other than voting. I can see why some members have become preturbed with the recent events.

So why doesn't everyone take a deep breath relax and think before we type another accusation towards one another. To me it's obvious that there are still many short comings on this branch of and organization is ran. I prefer not to drag the gas or nitro guys into this. This is our problem.

Al, I would greatly appreciate an ear to listen. You might have to go out to dinner with us though...then when we get you nice and loaded watch out! :lol:

ps yes these are only toy boats but I know that the majority of us take our hobbying seriously so lets not try to belittle the sport that we try to have fun with

 

[Jeff Shriver]

wouldn't it be better to hold a general discussion 1st?

I second this. A great example is the newly proposed offshore rules Kelly Brooks took the lead in forming. For a few months, forum members argued and argued and argued until a nice set of rules were hashed out. Everyone had an input. Everyone knows exactly what's on the ballot in proposal #4 before even seeing it.

 

[drobie]

The rules are being written by the few for the many. Yes we get chance to vote on what changes the few want but wouldn't it be better to hold a general discussion 1st?

There are active threads on the two most popular boards where the Sport Hydro discussion has be going on the a couple of weeks. Jump on in.

 

[Dan Chase]

Alan,

First, the people on the committee are just NAMBA members. We just got fed up to the point that we decided to do something about it. Every NAMBA member has the same opportunity. you can start your own proposal with a group or by yourself. My motivation is, I'm sick and tired of trying to enforce vague and/or stupid rules at our races, not that I think I have all the answers, I don't.

Second, and I can only speak for myself, but I have taken what members are saying into consideration, in fact it was Jeff Stevens and Kevin Whithead's argument on simplicity and questioning the need for minimum length requirements that made me do the biggest 180 degree turn since this all started.

Our committee is not the end all, we are simply the only members doing something about the rule book at this time, any one of you can start your own committee and submit your own rule changes, that the way it is, that's the way it's always been. We are just choosing to do something rather then just bitching about it.

 

[Kevin Whitehead]

Secretly writing up new sport scale hydro rules, pushing it through to the voting level at the last minute, and not allowing sufficient time for the folks who actually race these classes to get wind of it is wrong and you know it.

You're talking about changing a class that far less than half of the electric racer even participate in, by rushing through a proposal and quickly getting it voted on.

And that is voted on by the less than half of FE racers that care about the class, the 1/2 that don't, plus the entire remainder of NAMBA. All it takes is about 50 NAMBA members (who may have never even seen an electric boat run) to assume a proposal could never have gotten as far as the ballot unless to was good. Presto. All of us peons get our class overhauled, without even knowing an overhaul was in progress.

That is bad business and I think you know it is bad business. Otherwise you wouldn't have to rationalize it with "that the way it is, that's the way it's always been".

You're not bitching, that's right. You are not the one just now finding out about this nonsense.

KW

 

[Dan Chase]

Take a Midol, Kevin. If you don't like it, by all means, get off your ass and right your own proposal! Start a poll, make a contribution, DO SOMETHING!

 

[Al Waters]

Alan,

I guess that I will have to take you up on dinner. I owe Roger Newton dinner for coming to your Nats. I have to make it up somehow.

I am looking forward to coming out. See ya.....

Al Waters

NAMBA Vice President

NAMBA Scale Unlimited Chairman

 

[brooks93]

Al you might change your mind once you meet him.. he is a litte ummm crazy in the head if you know what I mean.. LOL

 

[Paul Pachmayer]

Hey Guys,

Al you might change your mind once you meet him.. he is a litte ummm crazy in the head if you know what I mean..

A little???!!!!! You know I love ya Alan.

Kevin,

You know, I can understand where your coming from. The problem is you have maybe a hand full of guys that actually race FE on a regular basis, out of that handful only a few frequent the boards. If you ask NAMBA a head count of FE racers they have no clue. How do you put it out to the masses when you don't know who they are?

Someone has to do something and these guys tried to do it. I can't fault them (nor should you) for trying. Kevin, your big into sport hydros, I would love to see you part of the group working to do the new rules. It's allot of work but if you want a change for the better get on board and hammer it out with the rest of them. I'm not willing to put the time into the proposal. I'll add my .02 but when it comes down to it I'll run the class according to what ever they come up with because I'm really not part of the solution.

Paul.

 

[T.S.Davis]

Al, That's the very group of nuts I was telling you about that wonder into town for food at least one night.

Guys, can you believe Al is coming to our race in an official capacity? On purpose! That's just crazy talk.

Paul, all the $.02 add up to big dough after a while. Even all the bickering helps believe it or not. A couple of Kevins' comments hit me right between the eyes.

S I M P L I F Y and how many times do we need to repeat ourselves? DOH!

 

[SteveReesor]

has anyone received the newsletter via e-mail? When I hoined last year,and renewed this year I had indicated that I would like to receive the newsletter electronically. To date I have not received one...

I wish to vote on these proposals and do not want to miss out.

My son Neil and I share duties running N1 mono at our local club in Toronto. We have both enjoyed running this class over the years. We may both be considered veterans now as my son has been running boats as long as I have (~15 years). Our approach to this class has and always will be to run it as along as we are counting laps and using a stopwatch. We race the clock, other boaters, heck anything including to the corner store. Its just plain fun. Are we hung up on winning at the expense of a newbie or rookie...hell no. We just love watching a boat run, making it run better, more bulletproof, and work on driving skills, starts...everything about it is just fun.

The 27T debate, we like 27T motors for this class at our club as we combine crackerbox with them when the turn-out is light..the speeds are not far off. We have a member of our club whose crackerbox was built by Marek Plescaz and its a rocket...in fact it keeps up to the pack in N1 mono. Instead of a 4 boat heat it can help the field and make the day go quicker.

19T, lots of valid arguements, and I will run it the vote goes that way, but the boats are decently fast for what they are. They are small, light, and about the same size of crackerboxes...

I discussed bowing out of running, but for the same reasons as Dan stated, club members like running against Neil and I and they are always asking us how we make then run well. There really is no secret, just good set-up practices, preparation, a clean set-up and, a little prop work...and an out of the box motor puts us in the low 1:40's consistantly. These skills are readily learned, and transferable to all of the other classes. Most of the members have responded that it may be considered a entry class by many, but they would prefer us to continue to run it for entry reasons (field plus club funds), and to measure their progress. Keeps us on our toes as well. It s one thing in any class to think you are fast. Its quite another to race regionally or nationally and run against others with a similar drive to push the envelope in even the least powerful class of "racing".

IMO its not always about winning even N1 mono, its about racing, pitting your skills as a builder and driver against others, the clock and yourself while having a blast with people whom almost always remain friends.

Neil (who's away at school but shares this mindset) & Steve Reesor