Turbo head button/plug

[TimothyJones]

Hi All

I have the option of going to a turbo plug.

What is the real benefit of having a turbo head button/plug and

what experiences have you encountered changing over from standard?

Theory and practical application welcomed.

Thanks In advanced

Tim

 

[Danny King]

I am experimenting with them in a twin 91. Bigger question is can u find the same heat range and compression ratio. Jury still out on my example.

 

[DickJones]

Hi All

I have the option of going to a turbo plug.

What is the real benefit of having a turbo head button/plug and

what experiences have you encountered changing over from standard?

Theory and practical application welcomed.

Thanks In advanced

Tim

Timothy

Do a search under this heading, few guys have posted about this subject.

Moby

Pulling Glow plug wire to advance ignition - does it work for a turbo plug?

 

[Andy Brown]

We have always run faster with the 21 engines using turbo plugs. About 2-3 mph.

 

[Mike Larson]

Tim.. there are more knowledgeable men around... Odonnell can set this straight... the wires on turbo plugs are thicker compared to normal standard plugs so in theory they stand more compression abuse... (?).. intendedly i use a very hot ignitor to light them.... i have a double ( glow beast) system just for that application.... in my testing they have to be hot to sustain the engine running/load, as ive had bad launches from a low heated plug... ( allow time for the engine to heat it?) ... per advantage, in only my opinion the cone lock seal on the button provides smoother fuel kernel burn.... and they do show a difference... I burn 10 to 1 standards to turbos and that sometimes aids in plug expense... ( if, i smoke a turbo plug, i was really really dumb on the needle... like... kick me dumb, or, I've a bearing throwing nickel around).... 21 engines only to date... idk... I've also found that searching the heat range for your boat and nitro combination will be needed... I run normally the nova 7's( either 65 or 70% nitro) all spring to mid summer and will switch to an 8 in august.... ( dont ask me, be it humidity, and ambient temps, less oxygen, etc, the 7's will show signs of failure, or fail.. and I change to 8's to launch and test) - boat tells me when... I can, get away with a 6 say either start or end of season but theyll fail easily enough if theyre leaned on.... theyre expensive.... but worth it... the Odonnel line of 97 and 99T work well also... and Im regrettable to say I've not been able to test the new V2 line of plugs as of yet.... I'm interested though, as throwing KB and Mccoy plugs away gets old.... (big engines)... the plug is the weak link we all have to live by.... invest and you'll be glad ya did.... Mike

 

[TimothyJones]

My intention is to put a turbo back on my N/R 21. It was on there a short time..took it off trying to find a problem(found the problem) and never put back on.

Does the head clearance stay the same as a standard?

BTW... I have the 97ts

Thanks

Tim

 

[aaron alberico]

Fastest guys I know all run turbo plugs for a reason

 

[Andy Brown]

Tim.. there are more knowledgeable men around... Odonnell can set this straight... the wires on turbo plugs are thicker compared to normal standard plugs so in theory they stand more compression abuse... (?).. intendedly i use a very hot ignitor to light them.... i have a double ( glow beast) system just for that application.... in my testing they have to be hot to sustain the engine running/load, as ive had bad launches from a low heated plug... ( allow time for the engine to heat it?) ... per advantage, in only my opinion the cone lock seal on the button provides smoother fuel kernel burn.... and they do show a difference... I burn 10 to 1 standards to turbos and that sometimes aids in plug expense... ( if, i smoke a turbo plug, i was really really dumb on the needle... like... kick me dumb, or, I've a bearing throwing nickel around).... 21 engines only to date... idk... I've also found that searching the heat range for your boat and nitro combination will be needed... I run normally the nova 7's( either 65 or 70% nitro) all spring to mid summer and will switch to an 8 in august.... ( dont ask me, be it humidity, and ambient temps, less oxygen, etc, the 7's will show signs of failure, or fail.. and I change to 8's to launch and test) - boat tells me when... I can, get away with a 6 say either start or end of season but theyll fail easily enough if theyre leaned on.... theyre expensive.... but worth it... the Odonnel line of 97 and 99T work well also... and Im regrettable to say I've not been able to test the new V2 line of plugs as of yet.... I'm interested though, as throwing KB and Mccoy plugs away gets old.... (big engines)... the plug is the weak link we all have to live by.... invest and you'll be glad ya did.... Mike

"the wires on turbo plugs are thicker compared to normal standard plugs so in theory they stand more compression abuse... (?)"

Just a note to intercept incorrect information flow.

Turbo plugs normally use the same wire as the standard plug of the same # and brand. An OD 97 and OD 97T will have the same wire. Novarossi #7 std will use the same wire as Novarossi #7 turbo.

 

[Samuel Hagan JR]

If it's the same wire why the better performance.

 

[Andy Brown]

If it's the same wire why the better performance.

After doing many back to back tests and pondering that question for a long time, my conclusion was what Mike mentioned, "the cone lock seal on the button provides smoother fuel kernel burn". We had a lengthy discussion about it here many years ago. Some did not agree with my conclusion, but believe it to be a better seal.

If you look at the chamber where the standard plug threads meet you will notice a great deal of interruption in the surface. With a turbo plug the surface transition is much smoother. This will allow the flame propagation to advance quicker.

 

[Samuel Hagan JR]

Gotcha. Good info.

 

[El Zorro]

I did some experimenting with different types of head inserts more than 30 years ago when I was flying controline airplanes. I made some head inserts to accept a standard long glow plug but instead of drilling and tapping the plug hole all of the way through the insert, I counter bored the hole for the depth that the plug would go into the hole. I was using Rossi R5 plugs at the time in Fox Combat .36 engines and you had to leave about .003 to .004 clearance between the glow plug element wire and the bottom of insert plug hole. If you were to tighten up the plug in the insert and didn't have this clearance it would break the weld holding the element wire to the plug, causing the plug not to work ( no glow, bad plug ). I only saw 200 to 300 hundred RPM with machining the plug holes this way on engines that were turning 18K to 19K. I can see where it would benefit engines that run in the 30K range ( .21's ). I did find some power and torque with this, making inserts similar to the Cox Tee Dee.049 "trumpet" style glow heads that worked very well with the Fox Combat engines. I raced these types of inserts in my Picco .21 and .45 boat engines for a while but did not see enough performance for the hassle it was making the inserts.

Henry Nelson was making engine head inserts many years ago using 1/2 A GloBee plugs machined down with a tapered seat to fit into his head inserts for his .15 engines. They worked very well, only you didn't have a choice of heat ranges to pick from. All in all, you do get a better burn in the combustion chamber if you can eliminate the glow plug threads in the chamber.

Dick Tyndall

 

[Don Ferrette]

Cone lock (turbo) plugs seem to be the most effective on the smaller motors where a good seal is critical. We tested cone plugs a while back when I still ran .21s and found an increase similar to what Andy posted. On the big motors the difference was negligible and in my opinion not worth the increased expense vs. the conventional plug design. Some of my best running big blocks were so "broken in" that you could push the piston right out of the top of the liner so I'd bet I had more "leakage" down the piston skirt than what might have squeezed past the threads and copper glow plug washer.

 

[Mike Larson]

Wire to wire i did not know... the secrets/tech of the manufacturers will remain theirs, because, well, if somebody made a plug that lasts under the abuse we provide, the engine/combustion provides.... we'd all swoon and flock to it.. wouldnt we?... i'll easily subscribe to the threads in the combustion center theory.... and id surely test head button configurations to ease "the pain" possibly, if i had the ability...( yeah, I'm the man on the needle, and we all want it... right?) Tim the 97T is a great plug... you may have to use the 99 if youre on a higher nitro schedule..... test the pair.... Jack is around, surely... but id ask... what they did to the new V2 plugs ( I'm circling to test them, and interested)... better wire?.. better ceramic seal compound, what?... I'd certainly had the train of thought that the longer body OD plugs entertained heat consumption/absorbtion than say and not specifically an Mc plug?... just my theory and immature possibly at best.... I only know my experience with them and stated my results per my findings to date... my previous engine builder picked off with a simple phone call, hard launching, puking 20 boats that my glow ignitor ( standard 2 volt D cell)simply wasnt pushing enough voltage to actually make a turbo plug "sing"... watch and listen for it!.... Glow beast purchased ( 4 to 5 volts), and the problem went away immediately.... and.. I'd helped another friend at a distant test session years back incurring the same problem..(Orion turbo exclusive engine) so... if the wire's the same... whats the deal?... plug body and seal heat?.... complete combustion chamber heat?... what?.... It must be related surely, in the dynamics of combustion, that... switching to the colder/coldest (8) plug in the dead heat of summer at least for me, works... ie: the 7's will entertain damage or show distortion, and i may hole a few, dumbly.... the heat kills the plug, in theory, burns the wire up...because, well... you leaned 'er down to get it quick... right?... I'll accept plugs and failure as a given for performance... but... if its the heat killing the plug, some guys are ( regulated engine temperature, per water regulation)... in theory more water volume may just allow me to stay on 7 range plugs.... its wide open.... now what?... ever see the buggy guys run around with their little heat gauges?... does touch it for 3 seconds equal 220?... hard to do on marine apps.... Eagle tree.. maybe... idk... the turbo wont lose performance (Tim) and... test 'em up.... Mike