Lets spin some numbers

[Grimracer]

Just thinking..

I fly nitro and electric helis and the electric are quite a bit more expensive per flight..

Lets see how that rings out in RC boat “RACING”. Lets average some numbers.

I will go on the high side of both nitro and lipo cost.. we are talking racing here..

I already know guys are going to “yabut” this

Yabut.. I can get fuel for this

Yabut I can buy a pack for that

Yabut I use this much fuel

Yabut my packs last longer..

OK.. Im open to discussion so lets learn.

30” tunnels…

Expendables…

Nitro

One gallon of 50% Nitro 40 bucks

128oz per gallon

6 oz per heat race

21.3 runs per gallon

$1.87 per run

Electric

One 4S 5000 pack 149 bucks

Here is where we have to guess, 70 “performance runs” per life cycle

$2.12 per run

Not to far off.. Its cheaper then Helis!

I have to document life cycle on the packs I use here for work.. the number is not far off but as we know it can vary.. Also.. I would bet most of you replace packs every two years.. Its hard to get 3 “Good” years out of ANY Lipo.. Regardless of who makes it.

What am I missing here.. anything?

Grim

 

[Ron Zaker Jr]

Just thinking..

I fly nitro and electric helis and the electric are quite a bit more expensive per flight..

Lets see how that rings out in RC boat “RACING”. Lets average some numbers.

I will go on the high side of both nitro and lipo cost.. we are talking racing here..

I already know guys are going to “yabut” this

Yabut.. I can get fuel for this

Yabut I can buy a pack for that

Yabut I use this much fuel

Yabut my packs last longer..

OK.. Im open to discussion so lets learn.

30” tunnels…

Expendables…

Nitro

One gallon of 50% Nitro 40 bucks

128oz per gallon

6 oz per heat race

21.3 runs per gallon

$1.87 per run

Electric

One 4S 5000 pack 149 bucks

Here is where we have to guess, 70 “performance runs” per life cycle

$2.12 per run

Not to far off.. Its cheaper then Helis!

I have to document life cycle on the packs I use here for work.. the number is not far off but as we know it can vary.. Also.. I would bet most of you replace packs every two years.. Its hard to get 3 “Good” years out of ANY Lipo.. Regardless of who makes it.

What am I missing here.. anything?

Grim

Should plugs and bearings be in the formulae?

 

[Grimracer]

Yea.. not a bad idea..

Plugs yea.. bearings I would say no.. they both have bearings..

Thinking.. your only going to get so many hours out of a Brushless the way we use them as well as a Nitro motor!

Grim

 

[Don Ferrette]

Should plugs and bearings be in the formula?

I was thinking the same thing. When I ran .21's I did bearings on them after every gallon of fuel.........

 

[Doug Smock]

Hey Mike,

We are getting three years out of the 5500 35c Hyperions. (These cells are not abused and are stored properly) We estimated nearly 300 cycles before we saw signs of a decrease in capacity or them gassing out. (puffing) The connectors wear out before the packs do.

The cells I am running in my Limited Tunnel and Rigger this year have been raced in my P mono for the last two years.

Now this was NOT the case with the FlightPower cells that preceded the Hyperions. :huh:

I'm currently running 5000 45C Hyperions in my N and P monos in a 2p configuration for heat racing, and have dropped to 1P in all of my SAWs boats. The jury is out on them, but I have to say they are looking very good.

I won't entertain the FE, Nitro thing just because it doesn't matter to me personally. Honestly my hope is that we ALL have available, at a reasonable price, whatever we need to continue to play at this level, for as long as we want to do so. Boats are boats to me, bring em and let's go run some circleee circles. :lol:

I just though I'd share what we are seeing with some of the higher quality cells.

Doug

 

[RaceCraftBearings]

Should plugs and bearings be in the formula?

I was thinking the same thing. When I ran .21's I did bearings on them after every gallon of fuel.........

You were changing bearings very very prematurely.

A good set of bearings coupled with good fuel and with good after run maintenance would easily make a year of hard racing! Including the many test sessions that went along with year round racing in Florida.

Electric verses Nitro in my opinion Nitro wins hands down! I really dont think you can compare apples to oranges.

I used to race electric cars and switched to 1/8th Nitro and there was no going back to electric.

 

[Grimracer]

Should plugs and bearings be in the formula?

I was thinking the same thing. When I ran .21's I did bearings on them after every gallon of fuel.........

Holy moley!... and I get about 5 years.. (I have been known to run up to 20 gallons a year.. JUST IN 21s!)

Your results may vary!..lol

For peets sake DON.. CHANGE YOUR FUEL... kidding!

Doug,

Cell technology is stabilizing.. Having said this we have found HUGE gains in the way the cells are assembled.

Hence Grimracer speed packs!

 

[julianconde]

Well you woul have to add servos, receivers, props there's alot more you can add the expense.

Ron I dont think nitro will win remember there no tuning other the setup of the boat they don't hvw issues with needles, leaning out and running out of fuel.

Julian

 

[Bill Britton]

So using Doug's impartial number of charges in the lifetime of a battery then you get

$0.496 per run. (But lets just call it fifty cents to be fair)

Oh, lets not forget the other supplies needed;

For nitro,

1, Glowbee (Better make sure it's charged! Maybe we should bring a spare...)

2, Glow plugs (just in case)

3, Starter

4, Starter batteries (Should we add the cost of charging these?)

5, Complete toolbox (Cause ya just never know!)

6, Supplies for blowing out the motor afterwards (otherwise you WILL be replacing those bearings every gallon!)

No wonder I bought a trailer when I was running nitro! :lol:

This is what I bring to the pond when I run FE;

1, Batteries

2, Allen wrenches and a prop wrench

I didn't count misc. items such as radio, tape, boat etc... cause of course those are common between the two.

Maybe we should re-calculate the nitro side...

I have been known to run up to 20 gallons a year.. JUST IN 21s!

Holy Cow Batman!!!! That's $800.00 in fuel alone a year!

Now I KNOW we need to do the math again. :blink:

I'm still on topic, right? Just wanna make sure.

DISCLAIMER: SEE SIGNATURE.

PS* I musta' went to a tougher school than you guys did. Cause you guy's are way too sensitive!

/B

 

[tom galdys]

Here we go again. OK, what about gas boats in the mixture? Goin golfing now,TTYL Tom

 

[Grimracer]

hahha.. yea.. I never said I was not a glutton for spending money on fuel.. but Aha.. what a delight...

Wait.. i have not spent a dime on a gallon of fuel in over 15 years...lol..

Bill.. the field eqip does not hold water.. We were comparing cost per use!.. stuff you do not "get back" after a run..

Rons Glow Plug was a good addition same as Dougs life cycle info..

Its looking more and more like electric "racing" boats are cheaper when it comes to cost per use!

Grim

 

[Bill Britton]

No blood no foul Mark, I mean Mike!

Did you see the new addition (no pun intended) to my signature? B)

 

[properchopper]

Uh, for those batteries it's best to recharge them between heats. So let's see ; 5 classes (boats) per race day - often back-to-back. Just for example (besides packs for each boat) 2 or three Duo's or TP chargers; humongo power supply & deep cycle battery, or generator/inverter. I don't want to add that up.

Gas/Nitro : one big container of go-juice & pump.

 

[Bill Britton]

Uh, for those batteries it's best to recharge them between heats. So let's see ; 5 classes (boats) per race day - often back-to-back. Just for example (besides packs for each boat) 2 or three Duo's or TP chargers; humongo power supply & deep cycle battery, or generator/inverter. I don't want to add that up.

Gas/Nitro : one big container of go-juice & pump.

We don't need to go FE to suck big juice. Not with a full blown Onkyo home theater system including 12 inch sub, Server quality PC, 22 inch widescreen monitor and printer in my trailer.

This was before I ever went electric.

 

[Don Ferrette]

You were changing bearings very very prematurely.

Sorry but I don't agree. I used to think that way until a bearing failed after about two gallons of fuel passed thru an Orlic modified NovaRossi in my B hydro, destroyed the motor. A very good friend who happens to be one of the best I've ever seen with 21's asked me if I had changed bearings yet and I said they had barely two gallons on them. His reply- "you were about a gallon too late." From that day forward until I quit running .21 class I followed his advice and had zero bearing issues on my little motors. Anyone who knows me well knows I buy the best from fuel to motors but I also expect maximum performance and will push my stuff very hard. I change bearings in my big motors every winter even if they feel fine. Besides bearings are far cheaper than motors.

And 20 gallons a season?? Geez that wouldn't get me to summer most of the time. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[Tim leyde]

LiPo= $149 ( I can get two good ones for that and a $10 back )........

As for a charger in another post you need one for nitro aswell.

I race nitro now and currently building a FE, I believe each has its +/-.

Tim

 

[Grimracer]

No blood no foul Mark, I mean Mike!

Did you see the new addition (no pun intended) to my signature? B)

hahah... I love it.. I need the same one!!!!!!!!!

ROCKET AND ROLL!

Grim

 

[RodneyPierce]

No blood no foul Mark, I mean Mike!

Did you see the new addition (no pun intended) to my signature? B)

hahah... I love it.. I need the same one!!!!!!!!!

ROCKET AND ROLL!

Grim

Get rid of the "ET" on the end of that ROCK and your good to go brotha.

 

[Grimracer]

I aint be dropping no ET brotha!

ROCEKT AND ROLL!

 

[HTV Boats]

Lets just say I think 70 cycles is low or maybe what you get in a Cheap battery. As for say two race seasons on an OS you should need a rebuild in there and a Brushless spec is about $60 for a complete motor so when it needs bearings I will just replace it. Don does the maintanence we all should do and I have some pet powerheads that see bearings long before they need them. Julian WTF do recivers and servos wear out faster in Gas/FE/Nitro? Glow plugs in an OS are pretty stable but say one per gallon at least. Field equipment and chargers about a wash but I will say my FE support tool box is pretty small. The keep your pond or have more choice of new ones / noise factor is FE for sure. With cement sea walls the canal behind my house will get me hung in the neighborhood running Nitro or Gas. They are all fun and I will still run each at different events. Looking at many peoples fleets I do not thinks running costs will change our bad habits. Cost however will make it easier for new racers to grow their fleets.

Mic

Byrd man glad to see your still reading this crap and that means we might see you at the races one of these days.