engines arnt engines.

[Tofastformellow]

hello to all,

there seems to be a heap of new motors out now and coming out , but im hearing mixed reviews of the different engines.... and i know of some racers are hunting for the older engines now...??? or changing brands completely

can we get some sort of list up with all brands and sizes of engines which are linked to sucess/ race wins or just have good manners . i know they all are fast and have all won races here and there but certian engines go hard and just go forever... but you need to know which year/series of engine to buy...

eg what year or model is the best for its size class...

certian models with different bore and stokes just perform better than others and some casings have more room for porting inside than others...

it would be a usefull tool for a newbie like me who dosent want to waste money on buying an engine nobody races because there is a fault in that motor.. ie weak crank , poor casting batch etc.

or does it still come down to an individual engine...being good or bad..

i dont want to bash but TRY AND FOCUS ON THE GOOD POINTS.

people with limited resorces are after a running engine to install and drive with the standard pipe etc.

however some race experts like to buy a motor only to strip it and make custom parts for most of it including pistons /liners /pipes and headers??

also it seems manufacturers are releasing more and more variations to engines now.

some examples from my limited experience..

a90 - a killer but even better with mods and a great water cooling setup factory

a100 - ditto

cmb 21 valvola engine - race wins in aus but no feedback?

cmb 21 valvola direct drive - IS this a good engine ?????

the cmb 21 rs - hasnt preformed yet in aus? why not?

cmb long stroke 21 - a reliable goer .

nova rossi long stoke 21 7+2 port - a goer but a bullet with mods.

nova mega 21 ev4 turbo = sweet older series motor

nova mega 21 ev5 = dont touch or buy it..

serpent michael salven 21 8+2 turbo = MMM MMM

the cmb rs 45 - bullet time ! but seems to have a problem with lasting.??

cmb evo 45 - reliable goer - sought after for reliability.

cmb evo 67 - reliable and bloody scary fast with major porting etc...

cmb rs 67 - ????

Cmb rs 80 - or hr 80 - ????

cmb 90 evo - a powerfull engine that dosent like drinking water .(cranks)

cmb 100 evo - a powerfull engine that dosent like drinking water .(cranks)

cmb 91 rs - seems to be a goer athough was it modded? for the aussie nats...

cmb 101 rs - going from nitrocrazed motor - needs custom headbuttons and cooling system to work real good.( stuff you just cant do at home)

mac 21 - a great engine but it dosent last forever..dam it

mac 67 - is a great engine but wispers are it needs different bearings and mods before its a bullet ?

mac 84 - seems to be a goer - does it need a bearing change? like its little brother

mac 1.00 - The Holy Grail ... its up to mr brown if we get to see it. (hint hint)

others :

picco 45 marine r/e a solid preformer but no parts avail.

ops 90 - an older strong engine thats a little heavy to be competative ..

os engines marine 12 - 80 - a great cnc'd engine thats built for sport boating..

this is some feedback from what i have been told / seen or have run myself lately

i think it would be most useful if we stick to near stock engines for now..

what stock engines can we sink our money into and still be competetive ??

changing bearings is not a big deal but grabing a engine and scratch building a bag of custom parts just defeats the purpose of buying it in the first place..

if nothing else can someone tell me if they have got the cmb rs 21 to fly yet?

and whats this 21 direct drive valvola like ...

i will prob try to get Mr Browns engines next (once released)

but have conserns about easy parts location in Aus (only thing stopping me so far.)]

i can get most parts for the cmb's overnight from melb.

ops parts come from qld and it can be a hit and miss affair

Have a great day .... Jason

im hoping for some positive comment or ill bin this post..

I suppose im asking people to chime in and add there engine experiences and the simple mods done to get em up and piping hard ....

i dont want no national secrets.

 

[Don Ferrette]

mac 21 - a great engine  but it dosent last forever..dam it

mac 67 - is a great engine but wispers are it  needs different bearings and mods before its a bullet ?

mac 84 - seems to be a goer - does it need a bearing change? like its little brother

Have a great day .... Jason

im hoping for some positive comment or ill bin this post..

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Well Jason here's my take from me on my & my partner John's (Finch) MAC motors

MAC21- I ran the crap out of mine all last season & it's still going. Found out my issue with top speed was in my boat, not the motor.

MAC45- John's 45SGX runs consistent 78-81mph in heat race trim STONE STOCK

MAC67- bearings & mods? Who told you that?? I've got one sitting in my almost finished Smokin' Joe's scale & again John's 67SGX runs 80 plus STONE STOCK

MAC84- same answer. I went 108 at record trials with a STONE STOCK 84. My twin hauls butt (ask anyone who saw it run in Atlanta) with STONE STOCK motors.

Andy & the folks at CMDi ship worldwide no problem.

I guess you can tell I like these MAC motors.

 

[Tofastformellow]

gday mate , thanks just what im looking for ....

in forever i wish to say that they are so good by what ive seen that you dont want

the fun to end ever.

i respect the mac engines very highly...

i got all hyped up about some of these new cmb's but felt deflated when i spoke to some of the racers here ...

any report on these new cmbs??

 

[Tim_Duggan]

I'll only comment on engines I currently race B) Might be safer if everyone else does the same to save the thread from deteriorating

Novarossi 7 port L/S is a performer box stock with the right pipe (did you see mine or Dave H's at the nat's or are you just going from the results? Dave's engine is stock, mine has had only the crankshaft done) Carbs aren't the nicest, but other carbs fit easily. I haven't got the new R1 series L/S engine. Parts are no problem, albeit the rear bearing is expensive.

Kalistratov engines.

K45 I don't own one as they have a bad reputation.

K67 - Brilliant engine with exception for the brittle wrist pin. Replace the wrist pin with a different brand, and fit full compliment needles to the bottom end instead of the caged needle bearing (CMB or MAC needles fit). I've been racing it for a few years and had a lot of success with it. Due to the shallow taper in the P&L you have to run some castor in the fuel and a 20% total oil content.

K82 - see K67. I Haven't done a lot with this engine yet. Paul Osmond runs them also.

K90 - same deal with fuel, needles and wristpin. Awesome engine - multiple NAVIGA hydro world champs to prove it.....

I have received parts from Al Hobbs in a week from ordering.

Tim.

P.S in the wrong hands some engines will apear to be average regardless of how good they are.....

 

[Tofastformellow]

Thanks Tim !! your riggers prowess is reaching people ,, trust me



i cant believe how tuff those FF boats are !!! (ask Dr Wayne! about his boating adventures down here last weekend)

Jason

 

[Ian Inverarity]

Jason,

Just to clarify, the stock head button on the 101RS may be fine, I didnt try mine as I always run my own head buttons. The stock cooling setup also would work fine, but I prefer my own setup using an A100 cooling jacket purely for corrosion reasons, not performance.

I also have an Evo100, and think the new RS engines are much better.

The A engines (90 and 100) have rod problems when modified for very high power. The carbs have issues with O-rings swelling and binding the carb. Some engines also come with steel cage bearings. The last two issues are fairly easy to overcome.

I am VERY happy with my MAC67, I only changed bearings recently, and I think I took out perfectly good bearings anyway. Stock engine. However, when new the rod rubbed on the case.

Ian.

 

[Tofastformellow]

thanks to all the guys whos work ended up here already!!

KEEP IT COMING.....

you guys r&d makes joining a club and gettin up to speed a little less painful.

Ian , Thanks for your work on those motors,, and i hope your baby is back together real soon

i havent forgotten your recomendation on the mac engine...

i would like to keep this going and bring in the good points of the various gasoline engines as well - or is this taboo??

Jason

 

[PAUL STIRTON]

Mac parts are avaiable in Aus through me I dont know where you did your checking but I usually carry them at most major race meetings

 

[Tofastformellow]

thanks paul i will be in touch soon. about an engine...

 

[gil sonsino]

Ok from my present experience we have

cmb 21 green head: great engine out of the box with turbo head and OS carb 4E

Ran 88mph on my saw rigger with heat race set up.

Picco 45 black head-still running strong on my SG 21 with no failures(glad to

have the 8mm crank thread on it)

Mac 67- killer engine with very few mods running in the low 90's on my heat race SG rigger.

Mac 84-timed at 1,994s last november 2004 on my saw rigger

Mac 84-running in the low 80's on my heat rigger 80 design

You can also conclude I'm member of the Mac team

Gill

 

[Flyin Rat Sass]

I have an O.S. Max .81 V-RM. any mods needed to make a real difference?is this a good out of the box motor?any info would be helpfull.

thanks steve w

 

[AndyBrown]

"mac 21 - a great engine but it dosent last forever..dam it "

What Does?

"mac 67 - is a great engine but wispers are it needs different bearings and mods before its a bullet ?"

"mac 84 - seems to be a goer - does it need a bearing change? like its little brother"

MACs are supplied with both German INA and Swiss WIB bearings. Both are very high quality with the Swiss WIB having a small advantage in quality.

We now stock only Swiss WIB bearings here at CMDi for MAC replacement parts. The Swiss WIB bearings we stock also fit CMB's and many other engines brands, so be sure to check with us for your bearing needs.

"mac 1.00 - The Holy Grail ... its up to mr brown if we get to see it. (hint hint)"

Stay tuned!!

 

[Tofastformellow]

ears up and looking!!!

thanks guys, can someone chime in with some os mods for this guy above.

thanks to all.

Jason :lol:

 

[Joe_Knesek]

My newest MAC 45 is the by far strongest 45 I've ever ran. Easy on plugs too.

I'm also liking the MAC 21 OB. I ran it against a bunch of Nova Rossi OBs in Atlanta and it seemed to show promise.

 

[AndyBrown]

Joe,

Our Lynx is a day away from being pond ready. We'll get to do a lot more R&D on the 21 O.B. now.

We are working on a custom lower unit too.

 

[izitbrokeyet?]

“nova rossi long stoke 21 7+2 port - a goer but a bullet with mods.
nova mega 21 ev4 turbo = sweet older series motor

nova mega 21 ev5 = dont touch or buy it..

serpent michael salven 21 8+2 turbo = MMM MMM”

you cant purchase the 7-port or the 8-port novamega variants of the MS motor. The EV (sx-21) motors are now Picco Made ZX motors in lieu of the previously available Novarossi made EV (sx-21) series motors. Boaters will probably hear about them in about 5 years but by that time the crankpin issues will be ironed out B)

The Novamega Ev5 is the same motor that I’m running now which is also called the Novarossi rx-21 R1….It’s an excellent motor but not for newbies.

The Ev4 is sweet but is the same basically the same as the Ev5…only a different crankcase, connecting rod and crankpin size. Also an excellent motor, but not for newbies.

Both of the Novamega motors will need to be converted to be viable marine motors. The Ev4 is harder to convert because it has the smaller Novamega crankpin and doesn’t take R series Novarossi rods (it takes XS) the evo 5 is completely compatible with the modern Novarossi motors.

The 8 port is unavailable to you as this motor was only available to team racers before MS switched to picco. The team racers motors are all used up. The 8 port is the same as the 321P series Novarossi. I do run on of the 8 port motors in a boat and it is currently not running as well as the R1. The top speed recorded was 74.6 in the 8 port VS 77.8 in the same hull/pipe/prop on the R1.

The Novarossi .21 motor is the fastest .21 motor in the world right now unless someone broke a record today, but needs to be finessed. The Mac 21 is a fine motor out of the box. Better if you get it worked on by CMDI….everything else is……..recyclable

I suspect the new RS 21 motors from CMB are going do well. I would buy one if CMB would beef up the rods a tad (wristpin end is weak). Rods on CMB mills need to be replaced about twice as often as on a Novarossi due to this issue.

“cmb 21 valvola direct drive - IS this a good engine ????

I’m told it’s the same as a mac, but with a CMB carby. Andy B could tell you for sure

have fun and call that spade a spade

KB

 

[Joe_Knesek]

Joe,Our Lynx is a day away from being pond ready.  We'll get to do a lot more R&D on the 21 O.B. now.

We are working on a custom lower unit too. 

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Let me know if you find a better prop than the ones I ordered. I'm delaying a trip to South Beach so we can race next weekend. E.J. will be racing the Lynx for the first time & Emily will be racing her MAC powered Speedmaster.

 

[AndyBrown]

Joe,

I reduced the lift on that 1440 for you and we finished the two 3 blade props.

If they didn't ship on Friday, they will go out Monday so you'll have them for next weekend.

 

[Joe_Knesek]

Joe,I reduced the lift on that 1440 for you and we finished the two 3 blade props.

If they didn't ship on Friday, they will go out Monday so you'll have them for next weekend. 

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Thanks so much Andy.

 

[Tofastformellow]

Thanks Guys....

Im seeing a real strong opinion from the mac end of the specrum..

these guys love their engines !!!

Thanks for the 21 info... although ive raced nova megas for a few years now..

i havent bought no rebaged picco 21...

none of the ev5's finished the world champs the year they were released.....sure they were leading the race ,, but all expired early...including salvens own engine.

this allowed mugen to win that year with the older rossi's

(reason i didnt buy the Early ev5 - only reason)

as was said they May have the cranks sorted now..

but im no longer watching 1/8th scale on road - i think of some of these car engines being suitable for the new lighter riggers around ..

the valvola 21 direct drive is much like an older mac prototype.???

.... but how do they run/Last ....?

Thanks guys , Keep engine info - updates coming...please..

Jason